Liberals also claim to view fascists and marxists as the same (a la horseshoe theory) but there is some doubt over whether they actually believe this, versus finding it a convenient thing to say in order to consolidate power.
Heres how I see it: the "cosmopolitan bourgeois" wants above all to remain the dominant class. The conservative bourgeois does hate them, but the liberal bourg will do anything to try to remain in their position and will agree to any demand made of them by the conservative bourg, up to and including killing those on the actual left. This probably wont be enough to save them, but they will still do it. They dont do it now because they dont have to yet but i believe that they will if they feel itd save their own skin.
"You fucking idiots, you fucking morons, you're giving away the goddamn game with your stupid antics. Stop fucking shooting poor people just like straight up. Just fucking stop. There's a better way."
There was a civil war analysis thread the other day
i loved that post, but it really gave me a good look of the diferences bourgeois factions in the US that i didnt know existed, i think this election will affect the US stability no matter the outcome
Do you believe that there is no distinction between the Petite Bourgeoisie and the Haute Bourgeoisie? No distinction between industrial capital and finance capital? These are distinctions which have been theorized and observed within the Bourgeoisie for generations.
There is no factional war within bourgeois, there is no evidence of such thing. Their common class interests trumps everything else. There has never been any historical event where bourgeios of one ideology killed bourgeois of other.
Also conservative bourgeois absolutely care about GDP, imperialism, etc. All of those are essential aspects of capitalism.
There's always a diversity of interests within the bourgeoise, a monopolist is in conflict with the petit or simply smaller bourgeois, exporters with importers. Further, the American Civil War was a massive fucking bourgeois conflict between the slave-owning and industrial bourgeoise.
I actually don't totally buy it in 2020. You went overboard with your historical analysis--the bourgeois do fight from time to time--and the ACW is an example.
There literally is. One half wants full-on globalized neoliberalism and the other wants to return to 19th century monopoly capitalism. Trump wouldn't be so decisive if it was just his words that was affecting liberals.
What claim? The claim that the other person didn't provide evidence lol??
Just give me evidence that there is factional war between the bourgeois. Any evidence, even a Jacobin article will do, so that I can analyze it and see how true it is.
I said give me evidence. If there is proof that there exists a real conflict between the bourgeois, surely some experienced political commentators, or Marxist theorists or even the intelligence agencies will be talking about it. Show me any proof at all
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If anything, they hate Marxists more.
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Heres how I see it: the "cosmopolitan bourgeois" wants above all to remain the dominant class. The conservative bourgeois does hate them, but the liberal bourg will do anything to try to remain in their position and will agree to any demand made of them by the conservative bourg, up to and including killing those on the actual left. This probably wont be enough to save them, but they will still do it. They dont do it now because they dont have to yet but i believe that they will if they feel itd save their own skin.
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Does it actually slow it down though?
I'm just about convinced that throwing joe biden into the presidency will just piss off the right wing enough to start thinking about organizing.
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"You fucking idiots, you fucking morons, you're giving away the goddamn game with your stupid antics. Stop fucking shooting poor people just like straight up. Just fucking stop. There's a better way."
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i loved that post, but it really gave me a good look of the diferences bourgeois factions in the US that i didnt know existed, i think this election will affect the US stability no matter the outcome
Never believe anything without proof. Can you find any proof that the bourgeois is divided into factions?
Do you believe that there is no distinction between the Petite Bourgeoisie and the Haute Bourgeoisie? No distinction between industrial capital and finance capital? These are distinctions which have been theorized and observed within the Bourgeoisie for generations.
For example conservative fossil fuel bourgeoisie vs progressive^* tech bourgeoisie.
^* aesthetically
Does Lemmy markdown really not have super script?
Just tested, apparently not unless it's very different from the way reddit does it.
There is no factional war within bourgeois, there is no evidence of such thing. Their common class interests trumps everything else. There has never been any historical event where bourgeios of one ideology killed bourgeois of other. Also conservative bourgeois absolutely care about GDP, imperialism, etc. All of those are essential aspects of capitalism.
There's always a diversity of interests within the bourgeoise, a monopolist is in conflict with the petit or simply smaller bourgeois, exporters with importers. Further, the American Civil War was a massive fucking bourgeois conflict between the slave-owning and industrial bourgeoise.
Ok show me the evidence of this conflict, like anything other than just your opinion. Any source outside of chapo.chat
I actually don't totally buy it in 2020. You went overboard with your historical analysis--the bourgeois do fight from time to time--and the ACW is an example.
Imbecile alert
Ok give me examples of bourgeios killing each other due to ideological conflict
La Violencia, WWII, various Central American civil wars, USAmerican Civil War, revolutions of 1848, argentine coup of 1930, Swiss Civil War
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There literally is. One half wants full-on globalized neoliberalism and the other wants to return to 19th century monopoly capitalism. Trump wouldn't be so decisive if it was just his words that was affecting liberals.
You have no idea what you're talking about, what the hell is "18th century monopoly capitalism"? Please provide sources for your claim.
Provide sources on your claims then, bub.
Jesus christ, logic 101 : It is the person making the claim that is supposed to provide evidence.
You literally already made a claim, removed.
Did you just try to use a slur? Not passing the vibe check
What claim? The claim that the other person didn't provide evidence lol??
Just give me evidence that there is factional war between the bourgeois. Any evidence, even a Jacobin article will do, so that I can analyze it and see how true it is.
https://monthlyreview.org/2004/10/01/monopoly-capitalism/
https://critiqueofcrisistheory.wordpress.com/three-books-on-marxist-political-economy/
Highly recommend reading Anwar Shaikh's criticism of monopoly capital.
But to get to the point, you have shown me no proof of bourgeois factional conflict.
Explain the American Revolution, then.
Slavery vs capitalism
Slavery was capitalist in Amerikkka, what you talking about?
Completely ahistorical take. Even if you dont read books, you understand the concept of New Money vs Old Money, yeah?
I said give me evidence. If there is proof that there exists a real conflict between the bourgeois, surely some experienced political commentators, or Marxist theorists or even the intelligence agencies will be talking about it. Show me any proof at all