Drama is when your friend starts talking to your crush behind your back or spreads rumors and shit. People being attacked and belittled for the way they are and their accompannying struggles is not "drama," its bigotry and it could literally turn this site into some kind of stupidpol or redscare fucking cesspool or much worse.
If you dont wanna stick your nose in any of these issues, thats ok, but just dont minimize the struggles of trans peoples. Literally pretending none of this is happening would be more constructive than punching down on people who just want to be treated with respect and have their voices heard. But ideally, please be a true ally and try to activelly push back against transphobia.
Just felt like i had to get that off my back, thanks my sexy commie comrades :heart-sickle: .
Agreed.
Anyone reading this who's very concerned about mod/admin stuff and has criticism to make, it would legit be more productive right now to not say anything, or ignore it, or log off. Hang out in the megathread, post some nice memes, talk about something else.
If you're super involved in the site and want to help, then understand the mod team's actions are a symptom, an attempt at fixing a real issue, the issue being based on the material fact of many trans, enby and poc comrades leaving and telling similar things. Complaining about the symptom but not the real problem only makes it worse, it'll only feed a negative feedback-loop of more desperate and on-edge mods, more doomerism about this community, and it'll spiral down.
It's fine if you lurk a lot and don't know what's happening and don't care, fine, then keep on not-caring by not interacting with it. This young lil' site still has growing pains and sadly a lot of the times to address deep-rooted issues that have been ignored too long it just kinda has to explode and be a mess for a bit.
At the end of the day we're still figuring shit out, and to be honest i'd rather we figure this stuff out sooner than later. It'll be fine, it's all good.
When Chapo.chat emerged as a site half a year ago, filled with ideas and hopes for their users and their site, the users and mods discovered a very awful thing.
And it wasn’t about themselves, even though they had to do it to themselves. It was about that reactionary encirclement. They discovered that they needed mods. They discovered that they needed ruthless mods. Because all around them coming in from multiple sites and within their own userbase were acts of sabotage, transphobia, attack, racism, and the like.
And they understood that if the site was going to survive, they would have to build up instruments of mod power, instruments that were controversial even.
And these instruments, by the way, can make mistakes, and these instruments can not only make mistakes they can ban innocent users and utilize their mod powers excessively.
If there had been no invasion, if there had been no espionage, if there had been no attack, if there had been no Stupidpol brigade leaving reactionary comments, there wouldn’t have been a purge of the users. If there hadn’t had been a Cumtown raid, there wouldn’t have been a user purge. And to lose sight of that fact is to lose sight of an essential force in what was going on over those few months.
:trans-heart: :parenti:
We have constructed a glorious dictatorship of the shitpostertariat.
Cheka murdering your father isnt the secret police's fault, it's the fault of the reactionaries cheka actually wanted to kill.
"Cough sure the cops shot that guy, not you, but you had your hands in your pockets so it's your fault and we're charging you with murder"
agreed, and if you need, take the self-imposed grillpill (without overwhelming the admins lmao).
I did, and I'm hopefully all the better for it - did some self-reflection, thought about why I was getting mad at the internet, and spent a day doing other things instead of digging deeper and deeper into arguments on this website that shouldn't have even been happening.Shoutout to @itsPina for remembering to unban me while absolutely flying lmao
The site isnt growing and you advising people who are out of the loop but not anti-trans to stop posting is the opposite of helping. Everyone is a lib except for me, once we lose that mentality we are nothing.
it's not gonna do anything if people log off for a week, chill, it'll be ok
Abso-fucking-lutely.
I was just saying something similar in the newest 'bored of the drama' thread.
Yes it sucks that the mood here is a bit of a downer at the moment, but not nearly as much as it sucks that this shit makes some of our comrades so miserable they're ready to leave, especially after they've put god knows how many hundreds of hours of work into this place.
Solidarity or GTFO.
https://citationsneeded.libsyn.com/episode-57-a-matter-of-survival-trivializing-trans-rights-as-a-boutique-identity-issue this episode keeps resonating stronger and stronger as the weeks go by.
Of course. This podcast of this websitr always has an answer
Hear, hear. I didn't know we had such a problem with transphobia here. I don't think many cis people realize what's happening which is probably why they pass it off as "drama". The problem is, trans people here are consistently telling us there's a problem. It's time to just shut up and listen so we can be better comrades to them.
Piping up to complain about the "drama" at this point has the same energy as coming downstairs as you hear your dad's car tearing off the driveway and with your mom crying in the kitchen to tell her to keep it down because you're trying to watch Family Guy
Ah, i've done this. Won't happen again, especially now that i've looked at the modlog directly
This brings up a big point:We need more education about trans issues, I’m sorry. Most people on this site consider themselves leftists and have genuinely good intentions but a lot of people don’t actually know many out and out trans people in their daily lives. What would be egregious is if everyone assumes they’re a paragon of tolerance and incapable of transphobia cause they’re a ‘leftists’. I don’t think I’ve ever received a complaint regarding transphobia and I consider myself pretty accepted by many transfolks online but I honestly don’t know a whole lot about the daily lives of transfolks. I’m very afraid of one day offending a trans person because I’m an ignorant dumbass.
We should have a thread or a series where we can clearly define transphobic language and in form people about things that Trans people experience on a daily basis. It sucks that we need to do this on a leftist forum and that it might even make the place seem less like home for transfolk but it must be done.
THANK YOU 👏 I honestly think we can overcome this, but the mods need to continue to smack that ban hammer on everyone being reactionary af and whining about measures taken to protect trans comrades.
This thread did literally zero to remedy the situation. Also don't assume I equate drama to transphobia. Drama to me is when people fo full reactionary on shit they have nothing to do with or doesn't affect them much at all. Like for example when we removed the Downvotes, and people lose their shit and bitch about it all day in 400 different posts. Or when we introduced featured posts to make some threads easier to find. And people lose their shit about it and form online militias and discord operations to fuck with the site.
Yeah but the assumption is that anyone who calls this drama isnt taking it seriously and is therefore a reactionary, basically they're crafting the argument that will get you banned right before your eyes. This is good, we always said we'd shed a tear of joy when the next generation realizes we did not go far enough and executes us for it.
Also like even if some people are thinking of the reactionaries as the drama I’ve seen people going the other way and/or painting with a wide brush in general.
I think reaffirming our stance on this isn’t a waste of time. It needs to be said
So this is the site's stance now? Will people who call this drama be censured then banned for arguing in bad faith? If we cant even smugly look down on fights we arent participating in, then we arent chapos anymore.
will people who call this drama be censured then banned for arguing in bad faith?
God I hope lol
Makes sense, three of my posts have already been removed. Chapochat died correctly and i respect that. Back to r/socialism for me.
Glory be to failed socialist experiment #86867589021 cause of death: falling for the same old shit
Well said!
I've stupidly used the word drama to describe it, but what I really meant was the people who think the mods have been heavy handed. It's a fucking message board, these measures are not a big deal. Just let the transphobes deal with heavy handed banning, let's sacrifice our "tolerance for transphobes" to instead make it a good place for trans comrades. The damage might have been done already though.
:trans-hammer-sickle:
Also to add, I'm cis so it's unlikely but not outside the realm of possibility that I'd at some point unknowingly say some transphobic shit. But if I got banned I wouldn't be fucking whining about it, I'd just feel bad and possibly grateful to have learned that what I said hurt someone - just so it won't happen again, on here or IRL.
You're reaction to what I had to say should serve as an example to anyone in a similar boat. Of course us Cissies are gonna say shit that's just straight up wrong some of the time, our brains have been inundated with all of this reactionary American propaganda and social conditioning since birth so there's naturally going to be some latent layers of transphobia and bigotry within, what matters is that people are ever vigilant of these blind spots and put forth the extra effort to listen to the voices of marginalized groups and do the little things to help said people feel respected and heard.
You have responded perfectly in this respect! Upon hearing my reasoning, you looked inside and made the conscious decision to modify your behavior and outlook to accommodate the needs of our trans comrades, and that's based as fuck my dude.
See people: all you have to do is be like @grisbajskulor . Its that simple, you don't have to perform some kind of insane liberal self-flagellation and build a fucking light-blue and pink alter (though that might be cool I guess), contrary to whatever all of these reactionary fucking stupidpol redscare shitfucks would have you believe. All you have to do is take 2 seconds out of your day to make a small decision to be better, and internalize it.
We can do this Chapo, I believe in yall! :heart-sickle: :stalin-heart:
but what I really meant was the people who think the mods have been heavy handed.
Yeah that's the only drama that I'm actually kind of fed up with. First they came for the transphobes, and I kept out of it because fuck those people. Some people seem to have a tendency to go all slippery slope on these things happening. In reality, there is no slope. Just a pothole in the road that the mods are trying to fix.
and then they didn't come for me because I wasn't being a dipshit online :pog-dolphin:
I'm honestly impressed as fuck with 2ch for how much they muddled the waters
Dvach, it's called 2ch now. You get great stuff like https://2ch.hk/b/src/237486968/16103113528681.mp4
