I was still a dumb lib back then. But my radicalization has really peeled opened my eyes to my part in continuing colonialism in Africa and imperialism in the Middle East.
But if I had never served, a lot of the understanding I have would not exist. Or how the military functions and how fucked up and clueless everyone is. Or how so many are working class being recruited for the basic conditions we as leftists want for everyone. Housing, job, sense of purpose, food, etc.
Just hard tackling all of this stuff and thoughts sometimes.
try to get in touch with leftists irl and teach them self defense stuff
I’ve joined the SRA, but since the outbreak started I’ve not been able to go to any socials or meetups. Plus I work 3rds so I sleep in the day.
They way I’ve internalized my service is that now I know how some of the tactics and maneuvers the military uses works. Which means it can be counteracted. The US is still training on the idea of fighting the Soviet Union, it’s broader now to include counter insurgency, but there is no adaption to an insurgency or vanguard at home. The same tactics they use overseas won’t work here. Because the conditions are different.
I'm bout the same as you. A lot of the people in my shithole military (Australia) were honestly very breadpilled, because people like Bob Hawke enshrined such strong socialist institutions that people still have a vaguely positive perception of them decades later. Having chats with moto guys in my coy who totally understood that the only reason they weren't sitting there with an AK in the sand was because of where they were born was very endearing, in a weird way. These guys were obviously racist as shit though because they're Australians, but that's the duality of man.
Also man, I got SO many death threats on reddit for posting about being ex-mil. People would go through my post history and try to find out where I lived/what my regiment was and shit. I'm sure some of them were weird rightoids but when you have someone with the name FemboySpaceCommunism69 or something calling you an imperialist pigdog you probably know they're being serious. Will this leftist infighting never end smh.
Before the sub got nukes I posted how being anti troop to a certain extent detracts from the goal of revolution and communism in general because we can’t discredit an entire group of people like that, especially the military, and especially the US military. Even a small percent of soldiers sympathetic to working class movements once the veil has been lifted will be necessary to fight. Or sabotage from within. People screamed and yelled at me and all this other shit. Like, how do you expect to win unless some are on our side?
I mean, look at that in the context of the old sub. Nobody wants to turn away vets who actually understand, but there were so many struggle sessions on that sub where people earnestly argued that all vets were absolved because of the predatory nature of recruitment, which is absolute dogshit.
I agree with you 100%. You're not looking for an excuse for your military service, it doesn't seem. But it's absolutely ridiculous, especially among the left for you not to be given a 2nd chance after you realize what's really going on. I hate to admit this, but I'm not perfect either. I've been a sack of shit before. I don't want forgiveness, but a chance at redemption beside my comrades would be nice.
I will never turn away a comrade who regrets military service. I wish you'd been able to learn without having to serve at all, but we all have our own journeys.
I mean, we need comrades with military training.
We're not gonna do a revolution with book circles alone.
I’m from a rural town in Indiana. With what you just said combined with family history of service and propaganda pushed me towards joining. Was never huge on the thank me for my service or the discount stuff. I thought it was the right thing to do. I see now that it isn’t, and all it does is to further us hegemony and try to preserve the dying empire through imperialism. Since we are in the belly of the beast, we need vets to do a lot of the fighting, even if they are not the ones to lead the vanguard whenever that happens.
My politics definitely shifted left during my time in the military. Being in Iraq and seeing how poor that country is and seeing that we were just acting like bullies over there really got me thinking and questioning the true motivations of the government. That country wasn't a threat to us and had nothing to do with 9/11.
Eyes left is fantastic. Shit has opened my eyes and made me cry and angry and everything in between. Most of my army buddies and civie friends don’t talk to me anymore because of my views. But oh well.
When a society idolizes people who do something, a lot of people will end up doing that thing.
Morality aside, it's entirely predictable that people join the military (or become police, or business owners, or landlords) and it's possible to be against those things while recognizing this fact.
Rather than pretending that acting in line with society's expectations is evidence of being a fundamentally bad person, we need to (a) focus more energy on lauding people who do defy those expectations and (b) point out how wrong the expectations themselves are.
We're all victims and perpetrators of Capitalist Oppression. And there may be a reckoning for that one day.
But the Military often are part of the Vanguard because of their involvement. Look at the Sailors of Leningrad, or the Germans and their lower officers who revolted and ended WW1, very nearly making Europe Communist. We owe so much to their bravery.
Somewhere in Catholic doctrine there's a line that says something like "God loves the worst redeemed sinner more than any saint", and I think that's true for those who were part of the Dictatorship of the Bourgeoisie and turned their knowledge and skill to that of the people.
I personally feel I’ve turned pretty hard line towards communism. Of course I’m still reading theory and always trying to develop it internally. Figure out how to apply it to the US, the working class here, etc.
you’ll always be welcomed regardless of how you came to realize these things.
honestly, what scares me more is people who do get drawn into military service and somehow come out of it with a positive view of the entire system
People who say “well we have to defend our freedom or they kill our troops” completely blank out the fact that we invaded a Iraq and Afghanistan for no reason. I always tel them, if the US got invaded, wouldn’t everyone pick up a gun to defend themselves and their homes?
Right there with you in the same boat. I actually think there are quite a few leftist veterans out there, so I wouldn't feel too stupid. They just don't make a huge deal of it like right wing vets probably would, for obvious reasons, but they do exist. Do you listen to the Eyes Left podcast much at all?
Oh yes. It’s a great podcast. I relied to another comment about it. I’ve laughed, cried, had breakdowns, got angry, and everything. It helped me get over the questioning of what was the point of it all? Gave nuance to the military industrial complex and recruitment and exploitation of working class people in our country and others. Always recommend that one. What a Hell of a Way to Die is another good one.
I don't know how, but we need to get all comrades who served into one group. The Eyes Left podcast would be a good way to get the word out, probably.
There’s a difference between imperialists and tools of imperialism
We're not immune to propaganda. And we grew up steeped in artifice. Raised by a generation steeped in artifice. It's hard to really excuse the military, but I do know they prey on the poor and working class for recruits. And the occasional sacks of shit like Mayo Pete. So it's hard for me not to empathize with the literal kids they prey on.
Anyway, I'm glad you're here. Everybody here but me is a bunch of fucking libs anyway.
