Stupididpol always identified with the "white" in the white working class more than anything else, no surprise here with their latest developments
Turns out the anti-woke left is pretty similar to the anti-communist left
Turns out the anti-woke left is
pretty similar tothe anti-communist leftJust because stupidpol is filled to the brim with idiot socdems doesn’t mean the anti-woke/idpol left is inherently bad
Leftypol is decent
This is a good observation. If someone's being negative all the time you have to make them identify what they'd actually be satisfied with. If they can't name it, they're either a wrecker or might as well be one. From our standpoint, this also highlights the importance of having both a vision for a more comprehensively good society and a few immediate policy goals we would accept as wins.
White people rioting about taxes on tea: honorable and patriotic
POC rioting about being fucking murdered by government agents: barbaric and unnecessary
unhinged r-word energy
Stupidpol is just /pol/ but stupider
Why did they even bother to censor themselves, I thought the whole point of that sub was to say slurs
When you understand that saying slurs is bad but you don't understand why
Remember that Chapo was banned for hate speech and r/stupidpol wasn't. Reddit's idea of hate speech has nothing to do with hating actually marginalized people, it's about being "uncivil" too publicly.
If any of these morons wanted to actually fight the police, they would start making molotov cocktails and start chucking them at the lines of riot cops
Why if I were at the riot I would simply fight off all the cops single handed and then make a vanguard party, I don't understand why the people actually out on the street aren't a super badass one man 26th July Movement like me; keyboard warrior mcwhiteworkingclass 😎
If it’s actually a good faith conversation, and not just people justifying their bigotry, you can emphasize that the time to intervene to avoid that destruction has already passed. The unrest is just the release of tension that’s built up over time, and it’s not going to erupt according to the preferences of small business owners.
If folks are mad about the end of the process, the anger and destruction, they should be mad at the racism that sets the process into motion.
Talking about the morality about individual acts within the context of a riot/uprising is pointless. It's like debating the morality of water boiling when it's heated about 100 C. If you're working in that framework you're gonna get nowhere.
If they don't want riots that destroy things, which will inevitably include things that they think are good just because of the law of averages, then they should be in favor of stopping the conditions that lead to riots.
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insurance
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expecting every single member of a pissed off group of protesters to have perfect discipline is a ridiculous standard that no group of protesters not tacitly accepted by the state could meet
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at some point, we have to recognize that not everyone saying "why don't X protest in Y manner" will ever actually accept legitimate protests
no group of protesters not tacitly accepted by the state could meet
No sizable group of any kind that uses any violence could meet that standard, period. Cops and the military do tons of collateral damage.
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Lots of good answers already; another one is to point out that neoliberal economics have done infinitely more to damage small businesses than any protest. Outsourcing and public handouts to large corporations have burned millions of storefronts. If they're outraged at one store being burnt, where's their outrage at the brutal results of free-market capitalism?
Just quote MLKs explanation of the riots, it'll break their brains as all they know is the whitewashed school history version of him.
Urban riots must now be recognized as durable social phenomena. They may be deplored, but they are there and should be understood. Urban riots are a special form of violence. They are not insurrections. The rioters are not seeking to seize territory or to attain control of institutions. They are mainly intended to shock the white community. They are a distorted form of social protest.
The looting which is their principal feature serves many functions. It enables the most enraged and deprived Negro to take hold of consumer goods with the ease the white man does by using his purse. Often the Negro does not even want what he takes; he wants the experience of taking. But most of all, alienated from society and knowing that this society cherishes property above people, he is shocking it by abusing property rights.
There are thus elements of emotional catharsis in the violent act. This may explain why most cities in which riots have occurred have not had a repetition, even though the causative conditions remain. It is also noteworthy that the amount of physical harm done to white people other than police is infinitesimal and in Detroit whites and Negroes looted in unity.
A profound judgment of today's riots was expressed by Victor Hugo a century ago. He said, 'If a soul is left in the darkness, sins will be committed. The guilty one is not he who commits the sin, but he who causes the darkness.'
The policymakers of the white society have caused the darkness; they create discrimination; they structured slums; and they perpetuate unemployment, ignorance and poverty. It is incontestable and deplorable that Negroes have committed crimes; but they are derivative crimes. They are born of the greater crimes of the white society. When we ask Negroes to abide by the law, let us also demand that the white man abide by law in the ghettos .
Day-in and day-out he violates welfare laws to deprive the poor of their meager allotments; he flagrantly violates building codes and regulations; his police make a mockery of law; and he violates laws on equal employment and education and the provisions for civic services. The slums are the handiwork of a vicious system of the white society; Negroes live in them but do not make them any more than a prisoner makes a prison.
Let us say boldly that if the violations of law by the white man in the slums over the years were calculated and compared with the law-breaking of a few days of riots, the hardened criminal would be the white man. These are often difficult things to say but I have come to see more and more that it is necessary to utter the truth in order to deal with the great problems that we face in our society.
-MLK Jr.
The full speech is available here:
https://www.apa.org/monitor/features/king-challenge#They are just as much a victim of a system that makes people desperate with no other option but to riot. Destroying working people's livelihoods isn't the aim or purpose of any left movement.
I don’t think there’s any “conservative” way to nudge them to the left on this except maybe to point out similar protests that they agree with in whatever color revolution/etc they’ve seen (but the cognitive dissonance of other gov=bad, my gov=good is a strong one to overcome). But for us, we know that demonstrations like this do not and should not occur within the framework of bourgeois morality imposed on us. Don’t forget too that many small businesses utilize the same practices as large ones in terms of wage theft and other class warfare, so it isn’t as though they’re innocent- they’ve just got a more human face than when a Target or a bank burns down, so it’s easier for chuds to share New York Post articles that attack the protestors themselves rather than the conditions that led to the protests.
Your conservative parents are dimwits and you will never be able to justify justice to them. Socioeconomically though, these small businesses tend to be a lot more plugged into the municipal political machines than your average prole. They may not have the power of the landlords or real estate developers, but their interests lie much closer to the YIMBY gentrifiers than the tenants and long term community members. They had the potential to lobby for better conditions all this time, but never stuck their neck out.
The central argument is that small business owners are not the fucking heroes they're made out to be. Some small businesses serve institutional roles in a community, but the vast majority do not. The vast majority of the community are not small business owners. Anyone crying about small businesses getting smashed up who was silent every time the cops smashed up homeless encampments can go fuck themselves. That's my take.
Sometimes I really wish Chapo's timing had been different so the community would've sprung up around literally anywhere other than reddit.
Let us shitpost around campfires, singing our hot takes to the skies. Let us pass on butchered Marx quotes from oldest grandmother to youngest granddaughter, to ensure that they remain unaltered for the generations. #OralTraditionsGang
With the removal of the chapo sub reddit seems to move extremely quickly towards the right. "It's always has been". Yeah to a certain extend but even moreso now and more extreme with the day. A huge amount of libs are mad they can't just continue grilling and move to the right. Which isn't actually a surprise.
Reddit is a racist shit hole. We should try to rescue as many people from it as possible and get the fuck out of there.
This is what happens when you ban one of the most popular leftist subs along side a dead right-wing one.
We start leftist-communities based on anti-liberalism and ironic slurs. Aren't we the idiots for thinking that it would lead anywhere but rightwing capitalism?
Anti-liberalism = good
Dude you got fooled by inductive reasoning.
Liberalism = Bad
does not mean
Anti-liberalism = Good
See how we both just typed the word liberal a bunch of times? The 'anti' is less important. We keep letting them brand shit. Liberalism isn't real. Lets just called them "center right democrats". we've been tricked into being edgy instead of accurate. They are kinda the opposite of each other.
Liberalism is very real man. It’s the fuckers who wear an Obama t-shirt, but cross the street when they see me walking towards them.
We can be edgy and accurate. I’m very against people who smile to my face while voting to take away my rights.
Liberalism got us to where we are now. Bill Clinton and Joe Biden have done more to perpetuate the continued enslavement of black people within the “justice” system than Trump ever has.
I get why you’re checking for brain worms, but being against liberalism is a good thing.
It’s the fuckers who wear an Obama t-shirt,
You're angry about a guy wearing a T shirt instead of being mad about rightwing media oligarchs buying up the entire political/pop culture landscape and framing the overton window as center-right (liberal) and far right (alex jones). We let center-right economics become the center because we stopped calling it "center-right".
Mitt Romney is a liberal. He is center right. Bill Clinton is a liberal. He is center right. We let them rebrand center-right economics + performative leftism as something new, liberalism and thats how its become the center.
I can be mad about multiple things at the same time. It's one of the many magical powers I have. 😉
Liberalism has been the enemy for a very long time. MLK wrote about it, Mao wrote about it, Malcolm X wrote about it. This isn't a new thing.
A lot of people understand liberals are terrible. We can win them over by owning that and showing them that those weak fucks don't actually represent the left.
No, capitalism is the enemy and academia was super helpful. They invented a thousand words that mean capitalism but aren't capitalism so we can deal with those words and never actually target capitalism itself.
Academia is for fail sons.
I can be mad about multiple things at the same time.
Awww, child...you think how you feel matters...you read rightwing bullshit on reddit and then ironically share it here and think thats something that matters just because it feels good. You can be mad about everything but you're clearly a person dumb enough to share corporate sponsored, state backed propaganda.
attacking premises
capitalism is attacking workers and you call them a premise. your education made you mean.
Workers rights and anticapitalism. Academia convinced you internationalism and ethics are real. Stop trying to use context-dependent logic and rule sets. That is how industrialization works. It makes it so you're a lawyer and only lawyers understand law issues so only they can weigh on the morals of our industry. And then they gutted our country with private equity.
There is only one issue. Stop letting them frame the discussion. It's just another version of "class-blind identity politics". If stupidpol is just a rightwing hellscape of political messages being promoted by corporate interests then stop fucking reading it and stop fucking posting it other places. You don't make shit go away by spreading it.
Be better than stupidpol loud enough and it stops existing. Thats how social media works.
What you’re describing is a single facet of bottom-level sorting on social media
"I dont have friends who will retweet something for me"
You realize thats how social media actually works? It's not ranting into the abyss, its social engineering virality with organization OUTSIDE OF SOCIAL MEDIA. There hasn't been organic virality since instagram was consumed by facebook. The social-engineering around your one "bottom-level" factoid about how social media MIGHT work is literally just "I don't want to organize but think I should still get credit for being a leftist".
You're reading books by fail-sons about the theory of why capitalism has historically been attacking workers. I'm doing the thing I believe in. I'm here attacking capitalism because its attacking us.
People pretend they're "above social media" but really they're just surrendering it to capitalism. If we all tweet 10 anticapitalist things a day with any kind of entertainment value and trendy pop culture references, it'll add up over time and thats how things get solved. Work done over long periods of time. Theory never helped a worker get a damn thing. We pretend we'd pick up a hammer and protect the line when company gun thugs tried to break the union but we're actually just a bunch of kids so scared of twitter that we formed a rightwing-themed leftist circle jerk.
It was inevitable once CTH got removed that stupidpol would degenerate further. Notice how this jackass says "Maybe someone actually there can provide an on-the-ground view" meanwhile there have been a plethora of narratives and footage coming out of the protests and from the people who live in the city of Portland who make it quite plain that the cops are the ones escalating the situation and the "action" is contained to a small area of an otherwise normally functioning city. This person is ignoring all of this easily available information, either out of ignorance or out of a desire to launder their anti-protest sentiment. The classic "Ayyy I'm just askin' questions" disclamatory bullshit.
I mean they give away the game in the very intro when they call them "rioters" but this is how their brains work.
