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It’s because they have the guise of caring about people but fail or refuse to see how capitalism is the problem. It’s a facade. Chuds don’t have that facade, the regular middle-lower class conservatives are more genuine in their distaste for welfare, minority/lgbtq rights and so on. I think there’s something sinister in that facade of sticking your hand out to help but then actually pushing disenfranchised people back down on their ass. At least that’s what it is for me. I don’t know if I hate them more but it is at least equal.
There is something sinister. It creates the low-trust societies in which the fascist phenotype of neoliberalism expresses itself best.
Gregory Stevens says it well here I think — it was even too much for this lib. “wanted nothing to do with actual justice and was more interested in guarding their enclave of power and wealth”
Any word on this guy now? Did he move left after seeing the shit he saw or was his “awakening” all in vain?
I didn't realize til I read your comment but this is exactly it. My chud exposure is limited to a few relatives and seeing trump flags. Libs are everywhere and I have to actually interact and be nice with them
oh you think you can just run the country without committing war crimes?
~ actual conversation i had on r*ddit
Something Virgil said on the pod forever ago before the primaries, regarding the liberal tendancy to 'be pragmatic': If you just choose the pragmatic option every time that just makes you conservative
One can feel dirtier during a discussion with Neo Liberals than with chuds:
Chuds use very juvenile shock tactics to shut down the conversation. It's almost cute.
When Neo liberals resort to insidious derailment of a topic into performative mercy and passive agressive instrumentalization of marginalized identities to shut down conversation, it really shows their true colors. Personally i feel a little disgust when that (routinely) happens. Like a lot of what they call "politics" is more of a learned social media strategy than something they really believe in.
I'd like to remind everyone that a lib is merely a chud who knows what they're doing.
You're overexposed to libs, it seems. Whenever I feel myself forgetting how bad chuds are I go dunk my head into thedonald or something and it reminds me how bad they are
The amount of jubilation is genuinely distressing. Dems won by the skin of their teeth. They're acting like they landed a slam dunk.
Even setting aside the fact that Biden is a Reaganite in liberal clothing, it's clear as day that he's walking into a minefield between the reactionary Senate and the stacked judiciary.
Biden is inheriting a trainwreck of a country and lacks the tools, the instincts, and the allies to make even token improvements. And Trumpism is more popular today than it was four years ago.
Liberals are absolutely delusional to celebrate right now.
The Libs are the somewhat rational ones, because capitalism works...for them.
chuds are basically schizos
I think the people you're describing are idealists and I think it's past time that idealists need to wake up, and that's why a lot of the left is fed up with even the well-meaning sort of lib you're referring to here.
Vaguely wanting things to be better and for everyone to just get along has lead to a fetish for civility and "bipartisanship" while ignoring material and historical evidence and conditions and simultaneously maintaining an arrogance and moral superiority is why those well-meaning libs are insufferable to me.
Even still, I see where you're coming from because I basically was one of these liberals not even a year ago. Being exposed to "get the wall", PPB, and other dirtbag tactics was definitely shocking and pushed me away at first, but it also eventually broke through my idealism and got me to examine what I actually stood for, what I actually do about it, what do I actually know about history and perspectives outside of the US?
Maybe it's not going to work for everyone, but I don't think giving every well-meaning liberal a pass does any material good in the end.
I get that, hate is a strong word - that's why I used fed up and insufferable. I guess my question is, what do you do when they still reject the language and context you're trying to provide them because of the association with "the far left"? And I'm not even talking about going mask off and bombarding them with Marx quotes, just generally engaging and pushing on some of their deep assumptions and being critical of liberal institutions.
"Meaning well" only takes you so far. When you mean well but still refuse to put your money where your mouth is when asked, what does it really matter that you mean well?
This comment helped me, thank you. I've been feeling nothing but bitter for the last 24 hours. I feel discarded now that Biden won and they don't need my minority voice to be against Trump with. It sucks. It really sucks. I've been a liberal apologist mostly because I really do think they mean well but hit a very hard barrier that most of them can't penetrate.
I do still believe in humanity's inherent good after all. Would I be fighting for them if I didn't?
They’re the ones that wouldn’t necessarily want to be king of the ashes, but definitely the respected elected leader of the ruins.
I don’t really have much to say beyond this quoted part being profound to me
Thanks for the well-written write up. I’ve been wrangling with my emotions and thoughts the last few days and you’ve managed to lay out my own thoughts in plain language.
"Heretics are worse than heathens" or whatever the old saying is
Most libs in real life are different than the very online twitter libs. They are mostly people who don't see or know of any other options besides Dem and republican. Names like marx, lenin and mao just make them think of totalitarian govts, because they have been soaked in US propaganda since birth. They convince themselves that the Dems have good intentions but just can't get it together because the Republicans.
I have a couple co-workers I'm trying to point towards communism. But it is a slow process chipping away at their liberal worldview. Any time I straight up say that my politics are revolutionary, it freaks them out. They don't really have a way to process it.
It's crazy but a lot of these people know almost nothing about the history of imperialism and colonialism. I've found talking about this history is a good way to start making them question US capitalism
Everyone loves democracy, I’d try mentioning all the democratically elected socialists that the US has overthrown.
