It’s literally a picture of a vehicle stopping in front of a pedestrian, if anything that shows how barbaric chuds are for running over BLM protesters
That's the whole point. Most people believe on some level, that Tank Man was run over. If challenged, they'll usually be unsure. They'll feign ignorance, or just say they don't know all the facts, but we know the gist of what happened. Even most of the ones who know he wasn't run over, believe that he was. Because Tank Man being run over makes sense. That there was a massacre there is a piece of information, the other piece of information is this picture, bada-bing bada-boom, that's the only story that can be constructed that fits with the given information. It doesn't make sense for Tank Man to not have been run over. It quite literally doesn't compute.
i saw on youtube, there's a video of that very moment, where the man moves to prevent the tank from going around him, and the man remains unscathed. Comments are all like "this guy and the tank driver were probably killed for this, so sad"
In China the military won’t run over a protestor.
In America the military doesn’t have to run over a protestor because the reactionary population does it on their own.
in amerikkka the military doesnt have to run over protestors because the domestic-military of law enforcement is a distinct arm of the government with even less oversight
stood in front of and then climbed on top of
before being dragged away by people with brains who know that quite literally picking a fight with a tank is not a good idea
They really heavily imply in the US that there's video of him being run over but they just won't show it because it's sooooo graphic. I guess I always kinda thought they did kill him but if the wikipedia page can't muster anything more than american officials having various theories about how he was killed in custody then it's pretty obvious there's no leg to stand on there.
Point out to Libs that Obama allowed the exact same shit to happen in Ferguson, including the mysterious disappearance of organizers.
if you havent seen the full video here it is
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qq8zFLIftGk
it took me way too long to realize this exists. i thought we only had a picture, wonder why that is
Lmao the fucking music that they put behind this. You'd think he was fighting the final boss.
What is this historical revisionism? Here's some victims they did roll tanks over (NSFW, obv).
In this instance, China bad.
While it may seem a minor distinction; those victims were not killed in the square itself, protesters in Tiananmen were dispersed without bloodshed. Outside of the square was a different story with a great deal of violence between both PLA and protesters. There were numerous cases of PLA soldiers being lynched and/or burned to death fwiw (again NSFL).
Chinese Government sources put the total estimate of fatalities at around 300 during for the whole June Fourth Incident, and wider protest movement, which most credible sources back up.
Here's a nuanced and informative article on the affair:
not to mention the anti-African protests that raged on for months that started at Nanda University & actually bled over into & inspired the Tiananmen unrest
fucking fancy lad incels
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DvhgBDpU8AAINmO.jpg
Doesn't change the fact that tank man is dumb. If they had gotten any footage of your photos then they would have made for less dumb propaganda (provided it wasn't a dead body that was run over).
Shit take lol "doesn't count unless it's actually photos of people being ran over"
The uprising started with lynchings of PLA Soldiers though.
If you got run over by a tank in those protests it's because you were a CIA funded liberal counter-revolutionary trying to lynch PLA soldiers because a CIA agent had chanted "freedom" into your ear long enough you were riled up to murder so China could be opened for Western corporations like USSR.
Here's a PLA soldier, hanged and burned by CIA funded protestors
https://iconicphotos.files.wordpress.com/2015/05/tiann_1.jpg
130 CIA paid for protestors, propagandists and instigators were rat-lined to the US after it failed
https://web.archive.org/web/20200604113735/https://www.washingtonpost.com/archive/opinions/1991/06/02/the-great-escape-from-china/5da31d0d-aca1-4c56-9178-767d14c29f62/?utm_term=.d187cf2f2940
There were only 200 deaths and half of those were PLA soldiers. It was a low level skirmish with some panicky, untrained troops responding to a bunch of brainwashed, Western infatuated dickheads
Let’s go back to those photos of the burning buses. The popular view is that they were torched by angry protesters after the shooting began. In fact they were torched before. The evidence? Reports of charred corpses being strung up beneath overpasses (one photographed by Reuters remains unpublished), and photos of badly burned soldiers seeking shelter in nearby houses. Soldiers in that kind of situation tend to go out with guns blazing – just ask the good citizens of Fallujah, Iraq.
https://www.globalresearch.ca/tiananmen-square-massacre-is-a-myth-all-were-remembering-are-british-lies/5386080
I gotta say IDGAF about those that fucked around with the PLA soldiers
These photos prove nothing, you're just propagating further CIA propaganda.
Dude you sound exactly like the fash defending the Greek junta, "but people weren't killed INSIDE the Polytechnic by the tank in particular, stop pushing this propaganda!". What difference does it make to you if they were ran over by a tank or killed some other way?
This is besides the point but, the manner in which people are killed, and the reasons for which they are killed, are all relevant. Crushing people with tanks is measures of cruelty worse than executing them by gunfire next to a wall. Having said that, the "people were crushed by tanks at Tiananmen Square" is all part of the propaganda levied against the CCP. It's a fabrication intended to make them seem merciless and to equivocate them to fascists.
Crushing people with tanks is measures of cruelty worse than executing them by gunfire next to a wall.
Really? I really don't think so. And I really can't figure out why you are so willing to die on that hill. Is shooting at them is so much different to rolling them over that one pushes it to fascist territory and the other is merciful and fine?
Low quality images of blood on the street and a crushed moped is definitiely proof that they ran over innocents with tanks and that you are a revisionist for questioning it.
The Hungarian Revolution was responded to in the midst of destalinization... so I don't think we can blame Stalinists for that
while they're both appalling photos, the tank in the picture on the left isn't operational, and doesn't even have a turret on top....
also, if you look closely at the remnants on the ground by the tank, it looks much more like a crushed bicycle or motorbike... no body parts or blood is actually visible unlike in the other photo
the picture on the right is gross though.
i mean, the stalinists decided to use military force against civilians, that’s a war crime and not in line with my socialist principles. I think people are allowed to disagree with that decision that was made historically by a government in power, it’s just a personal opinion
"The stalinists" you mean Cornshev who just denounced Stalin in a 'Secret Speech' which was immediately leaked to the west and would go on to make revisions to Marxist-Leninist (there's no such thing as Stalinist) policies that include
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denigrating the central planning system as a "Stalinist holdover"
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Privatising the tractor stations (farmers essentially collectively owned their means of production here. You just went to a tractor station and collected your tractor)
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restoring the profit motive in 1965
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Denouncing the era of the dictatorship of the proletariat and the Party is now a "party of the whole people" instead of the proletariat
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Announced it was now possible for peaceful co-existence between Socialism and Capitalism (rather than a fight to the death as MLs have always stated)
The ideology and history understander has logged on
Also the Hungarian revolution was a MI6 backed counter-revolution who's fascistic elements of Hungarian society (Hungary having been a fascist dictatorship for 25 years prior to Soviet liberation) and were lynching communists and jews and they deserved to be crushed
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/mi6-trained-rebels-to-fight-soviets-in-hungarian-revolt-1359599.html
https://diplomaticpost.co.uk/index.php/2020/10/21/the-first-gladio-style-colour-revolution-the-hungarian-fascist-counter-revolution-of-1956/
Apologies for unnecessary sarcasm comrade
For a full rounded history about the Hungarian revolution I can recommend this book
My friend’s dad identified as a stalinist, he calls himself that. I guess I am just going off of my anecdotal perspective with that one.
Some Marxist-Leninists have become so sick of the Anti-Stalin crusade in the Left have taken to becoming obnoxious and call themselves "Stalinists" but in truth nothing exists. Stalin did not synthesize a new Marxism as Lenin did (to create Marxism-Leninism). Stalin, theoretically and ideologically, was a Marxist-Leninist
If you are interested in exactly what Kruschev did and the policies he changed I recommend these 2 books
Kruschev Lied goes through Kruschevs secret speech and proves he was a liar. It explains exactly how the revisionists sought to place all the blame for some of the murkier parts of Soviet history on Stalins shoulders...So they could then begin dismantling the Soviet Socialist system he built
This book goes through the exact policies they changed of the Soviet system as well as provides a good theoretical understanding of why the Soviet Union was socialist and exactly what policies were revised under Kruschev then the Kosygin reforms of 1965
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again, I don't know the exact context of the photo on the right nor the one on the left, so the only thing I agree with is that it appears to be a grisly scene
doesn't mean that the victim wasn't a soldier or gov't official burned/beaten by protestors, as others here have pointed out occurred
still not sure what you're talking about military force against civilians lol, you are being vague I think
it's someone who responded in this same thread
"While it may seem a minor distinction; those victims were not killed in the square itself, protesters in Tiananmen were dispersed without bloodshed. Outside of the square was a different story with a great deal of violence between both PLA and protesters. There were numerous cases of PLA soldiers being lynched and/or burned to death fwiw (again NSFL). https://blog.hiddenharmonies.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/6.-Another-soldier-burned-to-death-hanging-by-a-cable-from-the-burned-out-bus..jpg
Chinese Government sources put the total estimate of fatalities at around 300 during for the whole June Fourth Incident, and wider protest movement, which most credible sources back up.
Here’s a nuanced and informative article on the affair: https://frso.org/main-documents/looking-back-at-tiananmen-square-the-defeat-of-counter-revolution-in-china/"
no problem, also check out the extent to which Radio Free Europe/VOA and former Nazi collaborators were behind the bourgeois nationalist uprising in Hungary
"reference to the uprising as a “pogrom”, insisting that “Nazis were let out of prisons by the thousands”. It also features Hungarian Socialist politician Szófia Havas, who says that “revolutionaries went from house to house in search of communists and Jews” and “the revolution couldn’t have broken out without groups of ex-Nazi dissenters trained by the CIA who were meant to promote a fascist-counterrevolutionary coup”.
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/obituaries/bela-kiraly-soldier-who-led-hungarian-resistance-against-the-soviet-union-during-the-1956-uprising-1741949.html
MFer was literally a Nazi collaborator
"Socialist Prime Minister Gyula Horn, who took part in post-1956 reprisals between December 1956 and June 1957, sparked outrage in 2007 after telling the news magazine HVG that “For example, I don’t consider 1956 as a revolution because there’s no way I could call Arrow Cross supporters who escaped prison revolutionaries”."
https://www.nytimes.com/1996/09/28/world/archives-confirm-false-hope-fed-hungary-revolt.html
Chapo and regurgitating right wing propaganda about 1956, name a more iconic duo.
If the person on the right was ran over with a tank why doesn't the blood trail look like tank treads? Also the picture on the left is a motorcycle or something.
Wasn't the person in front of the tank protesting because they didn't think the government was communist enough? I could be wrong.
AFAIK it's unknown who he was, why he was there, or what ultimately happened to him after he left the scene. The protesters overall were a mix of both CIA backed liberals (who wanted more radical capitalist reforms) and maoists/ultras (who wanted Deng's reforms to be rolled back), but what faction (if any) that guy belonged to is unknown.
The one time ultras do something, and it's to link arms with the libs and attempt a counter-revolution smh
I hate it when good communists are just trying to do mass privatizations and ultras whine about it.
The way this is framed is so stupid.
I’m sure you also support the ultra assassination attempt on Lenin’s life that ultimately ended up killing him, since his NEP was state capitalism right?
It’s very similar in function and in form. Using controlled and regulated state capitalism to develop from agrarian state, to capitalist state, to socialist state, towards a communist state. Just as Marx and Lenin described.
Deng ended up being right. His reforms saved China, ended poverty and the DotP is still maintaining control. All trends indicate towards further development towards socialism.
the DotP is still maintaining control
Are you sure it's still a DotP? Because thinking that you can introduce capitalism in every walk of life, every part of society and even the party apparatus but somehow the state will be unaffected and maintain ideological purity or whatever is literally idealism. And no, it has nothing to do with what Marx and Lenin described (especially not Marx, I have no idea why you are bringing him up here).
We don't actually know who he is. The most common identification of him as a 19 year old student seems to be a fabrication. The CPC say they don't know who he is.
The protestors had broadly the same motives as the Eastern Bloc ones. Freedom of speech and of the press, opening of the economy to more western consumer goods. Reasonable wants if you're not under economic and ideological siege by the entire capitalist world.
The only difference is that the Chinese protestors wanted to roll back some of Deng's reforms to reduce corruption and social instability. Deng Liqun, while not pro protests, saw the protests as an inevitable outcome of Deng Xiaoping's reforms
Americans can't seem to forget TAM, despite fogetting that its their country that's been constantly at war.
And the most ironic thing today was seeing the Lifetime Bitch bring up TAM and uyghurs today while it was reported by the UN that her own country's blockades and bombs have killed 200000+ people in Yemen.
Until like 4 month agos, I always thought tank man was run over. Everyone told me it was to horrific to show, but he was run over. Now I see videos of the tanks trying to get around and some more bikers pulling him away. Those US pig cars that rush through protestors is like a million times worse than anything I have seen from Chinese police.
It's not supposed to be "Oh my god the tank is threatening the guy!", it's "This brave man stands up to oppression". I felt like the symbolism was obvious. Man stands in front of tank in an act of peaceful protest. You're attacking a view that doesn't exist.
It absolutely exists, most people who pull out tank man do it to imply he was murdered either on the street or by the omnipotent secret police.
Your average American is convinced he was run over by the tank and there's nothing you could do or say to convince them otherwise.
i liked the scene in the tank girl movie where she forces the bourgeoise to dance and sing
Chump as tank got owned by some asshole with vegetables.
Get wrecked stupid tank.
the libs have been surrounded by sinophobic propaganda for years
We all have. Are you sure you haven't accidentally internalized some of it? What do you think happened?
Ok whatever your take on the protests are but in what world is tank man bad, unless you're talking about the guy himself being bad for stopping the tanks.
Its literally footage of a guy standing in front of a tank column, the tanks stopping for him, trying to move around him and letting him climb up to the commander to have a fucking debate with on the ethics of driving a tank before some people with common sense drag him off the street.
There was a color revolution going on with a smaller group of students taking the opportunity to try and protest from the left, but as a whole there was brutal riots across the city were armed rioters lynched and burned police officers alive and displayed their mutilated corpses, as well as stealing APCs and firing machine guns wildly, not to mention the usage of smuggled guns which were even present inside the square.
Like this is a bad uninformed take, the CPC handled the situation in the most efficient way they could and without intentionally harming people that were no threat, like the students in the square or tank man.
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EZw1sNoXYAY24l6?format=jpg&name=medium
