1 in 5 people catching covid have long covid, but fuck you if you don’t want to take that risk in exchange for some treats. Just get yourself and everyone you know infected again and again, it’s fine.
(Apologies comrades, but both archive failed to work, and nitter looks broken, possibly due to Elon banning third party apps?)
I really fucking hate the way trying to stay safe is pathologized
You're not living your life, you shut-in. :maybe-later-honey: :covid-cool: :grillman: :corona: :maybe-later-kiddo:
I think it's a commercial real-estate astroturf. They're hoping by making social changes caused or accelerated by the pandemic seem outlandish they might be able to reverse the wfh trend.
wfh is an ideological dogwhistle at this point, with how right wing chud ceos brag about forcing their "workforce" back to the office
like, dude, you're hiring people from all over the world, most of them don't have any business sitting in an office
I sometimes have 8am video calls with the European and Indian teams at my company. It's juat completely impractical for me to be in the office for those, lol.
And when they do go outside, they're not even having fun, they're just sleepwalking as usual.
That's what really does it for me, people are fighting tooth and nail to fuck over the immunocompromised and other vulnerable groups so they can walk around the fucking mall.
it's internalized toxic masculinity, this whole shit about how ppe and caring about occupational health and safety is for pussies, supposedly, just scaled up to the entire society
The majority of the country - and much of the world for that matter - stopped caring about COVID. Why do these freaks of nature keep complaining about everything after getting everything they want? EVRERY SINGLE TIME. That’s the most obnoxious shit ever.
that’s true but on the other hand the tone of that thread about HEPA filters at Davos lately was so annoying that I think maybe we shouldn’t do anything
Literal child.
It's because they know they're wrong, and being told so makes them upset. It's the same thing as the kneejerk reactions to vegans.
that thread about HEPA filters at Davos lately was so annoying
minor internet celebrities with inflated egos + lib tone-policing: name a better duo
I'd like to pair this with her assertion a couple weeks ago that China fumbled their covid response because "they didn't buy enough western vaccines"
She's on a bad take marathon
that China fumbled their covid response because “they didn’t buy enough western vaccines”
... let me just call up my geopolitical arch-rival who is gearing up for a genocidal 3rd world war against me and buy their medicine
The first episode I've listened to in over a year and she just shits out this take in the first ten minutes, I just turned it off like give me a fuckin break, if I wanted to listen to that asinine level of analysis I'd wacth CNN
While I guess not as bad her "mastodon is bad because too many mods" take seems designed to irritate me specifically and has basically the same structure of treat defending backed with severe misunderstanding of what is being criticized. I'm rapidly starting to find her more annoying than Liam.
Rocz and Devon do all the work. Alice and Liam just say shitty things and soak up free money.
Also except for Devon they're all admitted alcoholics who aren't even trying to quit, so the patreon is just enabling them tbh. Liam's excuse is "I used to be addicted to heroin, so this is nothing."
I do believe Liam’s been trying to quit/severely cut back lately from a couple comments he’s made on the last few episodes
I don’t get this take? Is my work from home job “enabling” me?
Probably not. especially if you're expected to appear on webcam and write coherent emails and make coherent phone calls.
Why is podcasting any different?
Because, and yes this varies to some extent, but in the case of WTYP they make enough now (at least 30K a month now, probably more, so probably 10K a month for reach of them, 120K a year), you get way more disposable income than you do from a normal job and you're literally allowed to be drunk on the job, which you only have to do once a week, or in the case of WTYP, once every whenever they feel like it.
they are just entertainers
Meh. That's never been a good excuse when actors or comedians punch down or say problematic shit, so why should this be an excuse for podcasters?
let them have their vices if they want to.
this implies I or anyone else has the power to do otherwise, lmao. Was I stopping WTYP by criticizing them? No, of course not. When you say "let them have their vices", the subtext is "don't publicly push back when they're wrong!"
its not like, incumbent on the audience to deprive them of a living to stop enabling them
things nobody said. Besides, I can't withdraw my patreon money from them because i never gave it to them in the first place
You left out the part where she stated "it also gives them a good excuse to continue their actions in Xinjiang"
Put me off the TF extended universe. Still going to keep bootlegging TF itself for Riley's financial news summaries but not giving them a penny.
How does that even work? Like forget any bias or doubts about Xinjiang, how from her POV would covid help their actions? Excuse more lockdowns? according to this pov seems they already have everyone in camps so that wont change anything
How the fuck can people who call themselves communist in those comments think when leftists are calling for COVID lockdowns as part of our political programme that we're not going to pay people? Like, they keep saying "people need to work to pay rent" and it's like, do they not know about the concept of compensation? They can't think one step ahead of their already short sighted arguments. They sound like conservalibs. If it was about how little influence we have and that the only thing they think the capitalist class would do that's anti-COVID would be uncompensated lockdowns (again) I could understand, but that's not what they're saying so they sound like fucking morons.
Edit: rent compensations/rent-abolition, obviously. We don't want to pay landlords, obviously.
The deep unapologetic ableism in Alice’s attitude and the replies is fucking disgusting. I’ve seen it a lot from “famous” left people of late (eg Owen Jones). They simply can’t wait to throw disabled people under the bus to get back to their treats.
Yeah, the "oh you're immunocomprimised? That's cute you're still taking COVID seriously. Hope that works out for you. I'm not going to change a thing in my behaviour for you" attitude's really insulting.
Also the implied reasoning with all of this is that immunocompromised people represent a very small percentage of the population so it's okay to shit all over them. It takes an impressive lack of self-crit for that kind of argument to be coming from a trans woman.
There's a conversation to be had about how we're basically just making wishes to a capitalist genie and need to be aware of monkey's paw-like results. Because if we just ask and message about anti-COVID stuff without anti-capitalism that we're just gunna' end up with more 2020s over and over (at best), but again, they're not saying or thinking this, really. They really just want people to shut the fuck up about COVID entirely.
a lot of the covid-awareness available on social media is definitely divorced entirely from class analysis and obnoxious as fuck. like yelling at people for not recycling tier. anyone talking about this should also be talking about the disabled being disproportionately precarious and likely to be in a position to being forced to choose between working among a viral pandemic that can kill them or staying home and losing it or starving, etc.
that doesn't make alice's take any less shitty. worse if anything because it critiques the good part of the messaging and entirely ignores the bad part
idk both are annoying but alice sucks harder. i'd say she should know better but at this point if you think she's a comrade idk lurk more
just virtue signaling on behalf of a proletariat they're not a member of. these public figure grifters do it all the time
, do they not know about the concept of compensation?
no they have no idea about that because the us government gave people a pittance instead of a rent freeze, food, and maoism.
Lots to dunk on, but I'm gonna nitpick.
Agoraphobia? Going actually outside is one of the safest places to be.
If i've developed anything, it's maskless claustrophobia.
Excellent point, it completely breezed over my head! Yet another classic example of Alice getting details hopelessly wrong with brazen confidence. The nuclear take it was wrapped within distracted from it!
Until it starts hurting rich people, the US government isn't going to lift a finger. Maybe not even then.
covid really let us down not taking out trump, johnson, bolsonaro...
That probably has more to do with like 50% of the population believing vaccines will kill you than it does with COVID procedures, or the entire west would be as bad off as the US
and also how usa is just a "third world country"'s idea of a "first world country"
cosplaying a developed nation while it's not realy
I would argue it's in a league of it's own: "Third-world-by-choice"
I'll cut Hawai'i and Puerto Rico some slack as they are occupied nations, so they're moreso exploited against their will. Same with the rest of the global south. They are over-exploited: we can see this in history because the Arab World and North Africa used to be the big "wealthy" zone. Ehh, maybe Mediterranean Europe too (not that I'm biased :anti-italian-action:). So we know that they are not poor because of the /pol/ fantasy that white people are the only people worth a damn.
But what excuse does the US have for things being so bad? "Muh diversity"? Then why is Cuba still kicking DESPITE the embargo? Switzerland has three official languages and consistently ranks as one of the best countries for QoL? If you mean to imply that black people are some kind of bad luck charm, you are delusional. At best, one could say they are winning some arbitrary moral victory about "freedom", but that's rich coming from the country that's the ringleader of the 14 eyes.
:grillman:: "COVID responses are the same as climate responses! Population control!"
Mio fratello in Cristo, not doing anything in response to COVID IS the population control! Letting porky pollute all he wants and telling anyone who's lives are threatened by climate change to die IS the population control!
How the hell can ANYONE be convinced that measures taken that are proven to extend both life expectancy and public health are population control?
it also reeks of the privilege of never having to go somewhere where you might get covid in order to, say, pay rent
:jesse-wtf:
I still don't understand what the fuck is up with the entire :wtyp-gang: and their respective ideologies. Like I understand that Liam is a weird anarchist who mostly hates cops, and who gets dunked on by his weirdo Trotskyite dad, and Roz seems to just want to burn the US to the ground and build traintracks on the ashes. Alice is pro-USSR but anti AES, which is such a strange combination of things to believe in, that I struggle to understand how she even arrived at that specific conclusion.
She is a white-British-trans-Muslim who I am 90% positive was either in the military or at least whatever the British equivalent of the ROTC was, who was going to get a law degree (in Britain!) before stumbling ass-backwards into podcasting fame (?) and success.
Everything about her and her opinions is incredibly idiosyncratic, and I think mostly proves that if Allah exists, they mostly love her and fucking with all of us.
nah she was cadets afaik, which is weird army grooming shit for when you're 12-18, not actual military stuff
oooh, my first cursory google didn't show that they had high school programs too. love to have child soldiers
Yeah, I still follow both WTYP and Trashfuture, so I know sort of what Alice's identity is. I just still don't understand anything about how she arrives at the conclusions that she does. I also DESPERATELY want to ask her if she became muslim before or after she had her egg-crack-moment (sorry, not entirely sure what the correct terminology is).
I've been listening a long time to most of their stuff (long shifts and needing to fill time mostly, I limit myself to listening to the entire History of Rome once a year), and all I can tell you is that it is mostly based off of whatever they think will piss 'tankies' (basically Twitter ML's) off the most.
There is no real coherent theory, or justification, or any actual thought, I'm pretty sure it comes down to mostly oppositional posting. Egg on people who don't know how to log off to feed the algorithm.
Also, no idea. I would probably not like to talk to her for any real length of time, because, much like Zizek, she is a deeply unserious person.
I just still don’t understand anything about how she arrives at the conclusions that she does.
She got to spend a quarter of her life eating shit for being Trans. That'll leave its mark. If she was raised in the Balkins or Belarus, I imagine she might have come out as an anti-comm reactionary for similar reasons. Also, she's Scottish, I think? Which means she's predisposed to kinda hate England on principle as well as the merits.
Plenty of American Leftists who run the spectrum on bad beliefs. But I notice Alice eating tons of shit more for being a high profile trans-podcaster-leftist than for anything she says that's particularly damning. A woman on five different podcasts who didn't issue the occasional bad-take would either be the most PC organism on the planet or the reincarnation of Lenin.
I also DESPERATELY want to ask her if she became muslim before or after she had her egg-crack-moment
I feel like this has been answered at some point somewhere. But it also kinda feels like it was synchronous. In a Western WASP country, Islamic spirituality offered a refuge from Anglican bigotry.
On the Bicycle episode of WTYP she mentioned having grown up in Southern London, which also explains why she hasn't got anything resembling a scottish accent. She does however live in Glasgow and have been for a while. Honestly I don't think she gets more shit for being a trans podcaster as much as she gets constantly shat on for being extremely online. Like I get that her job is to make entertainment, and I've even admitted to still following some of her work, so clearly she is good at it, but she really needs to stop tweeting sometimes.
Also American leftists have plenty of bad takes, and they also usually get told to shut the fuck up. Only reason the Chapo guys don't feature more on this site is because only a fraction of our active users even follow them.
she really needs to stop tweeting sometimes.
Sure. Her and the rest of us.
But this is a woman with politics easily comparable to a Jack Flores or Liz Fransac. She's routinely described in the same terms as Va*sh or Destiny.
Only reason the Chapo guys don’t feature more on this site is because only a fraction of our active users even follow them.
Which sort of begs the question of where they're even coming from.
Do a lot of people here follow Liz Fransac? I have no idea who the fuck Jack Flores is, but I don't remember seeing a lot of people talk about Liz' personal twitter. I also don't really think most people here listen to Truanon in the first place, so she naturally will get less scrutiny than Alice, who is still the cohost of one of the better podcasts :wtyp:
A lot of people follow TrueAnon. Brace is the more colorful one, but Liz Franczak (apologies for my butchered spelling in the original) does a ton of the leg work.
I have no idea who the fuck Jack Flores
Should be Jake. He's the lead on Pod Damn America. And he's at least as popular as anyone at The Antifada or Rev Left Radio.
she naturally will get less scrutiny than Alice,
If you're hooked into the Nate Bethay extended universe but you don't follow any of the folks who frequently show up on the Chapo podcast... throws up hands
How the fuck did you even find this place?
I listened to Chapo for quite a long time, and made an account here within the first week of this site opening, after the original ChapoTrapHouse sub got banned. I vaguely know what you mean by Nate Bethay-universe, but I don't typically listen to anything that gets plugged by the guests on the Chapo pod.
It seems pretty transparent to me when beloved figures like Felix Biederman have expressed the exact same anti covid restriction sentiment on Twitter and the podcast but nobody seems to bring it up.
The guy has tweets getting pissy about having to wear a mask in the gym but if Alice said something like that it would get 500 upbeats in the dunk tank lol
Liam is actually a Markov bot programmed solely with "go fuck yourselves"
Roz seems to just want to burn the US to the ground and build traintracks on the ashes.
no wonder roz is my favorite
Alice is pro-USSR but anti AES, which is such a strange combination of things to believe in, that I struggle to understand how she even arrived at that specific conclusion.
USSR: had some white people
AES: have no white people
It's really that simple. You shouldn't have to think too hard about it. It's like how liberals don't understand why people like Trump when people like Trump mostly because he's a white supremacist piece of shit and they're also white supremacist pieces of shit.
Same with the GDR jokes, 1. Doesn't exist anymore (I don't here anybody laughing at unwavering support for cuba) and 2. Is white, are the criteria for supporting socialism
I'm asking what this is in reference to, not what names you've decided to call her.
have you listened to Kill James Bond? The hosts there, including Alice, are open about how they uphold the legacy of the USSR and the GDR in both joking and unironic terms. This is in stark contrast to her feelings on, say, Cuba, Vietnam, or China, which either aren’t mentioned, or are spoken of the same way the BBC would, uncritical restatement of propaganda
have you listened to Kill James Bond?
Cover to Cover. One of the few podcasts I actually pay for, even through the Winter of Content.
The hosts there, including Alice, are open about how they uphold the legacy of the USSR and the GDR in both joking and unironic terms.
I got an earful of coverage about the GDR during "The Lives of Others" episode and if you think they "upheld" its "legacy", you're deeply mistaken. As to the USSR, Alice is deeply ambivalent on it in pretty much every podcast setting. WTYP - the Supersonic aircraft and Nedelin Catastrophe eps - have her utterly torn between their ambitions and failures. The Nicolae Ceausescu episode might as well have been about the fuck-ups of Eastern European central planning. While she's happy to slam "The Internationale" button to egg on Liam, she's no Stalinist by any stretch.
This is in stark contrast to her feelings on, say, Cuba, Vietnam, or China, which either aren’t mentioned, or are spoken of the same way the BBC would, uncritical restatement of propaganda
Which episode trashes Cuba or Vietnam? Again, I keep hearing these vague insinuations and unsourced allegations. I'm still waiting for a thing she actually said that justifies the criticism. The worst thing I've heard her say about Cuba is that it is a poor country. And she's hardly shy about saying why the blockade is to blame.
The only criticisms I've heard on China are the exact same criticisms you hear from every other Western Leftist - namely, that Xi's not hitting the Full Communism button fast or hard enough, that even Chinese cops fall under ACAB, that Taiwan is a lost cause, etc. Even then, it tends to be couched in the "I'm no expert on China" and "Hardly worse than what Americans are up to" caveats.
I fucking wish the BBC anchors had that attitude towards the AES states.
She’s big on the Xinjiang propaganda till this day, idk what to tell you. I’ve never heard her make a positive assessment of the Chinese path to socialism in any way
She’s big on the Xinjiang propaganda till this day
Point to the episode. Point to the tweet. Show me where the body is buried.
I’ve never heard her make a positive assessment of the Chinese path to socialism in any way
Fuck, you sound like one of those dipshit Republicans whining about Barack Obama never saying "Radical Islamic Terror". Ted Cruz wants his talking points back.
Alice is pro-USSR but anti AES, which is such a strange combination of things to believe in, that I struggle to understand how she even arrived at that specific conclusion.
well, if a country doesn't exist anymore, it doesn't have to deal with modern contradictions. A dead country will then become a mythical land for people to jerk off intellectually on.
With a lot of online discourse the false premises come from one underlying assumption: that the small group of weirdos you either hang out with or laugh at online constitute a mass phenomenon and aren't just a small group of weirdos.
Like I'm sure it's the case that some people drove themselves crazy over covid by being online more. But the majority of people I know didn't. Their habits shifted but I don't know anyone who has actual agorophobia because of the pandemic.
:100-com: like I don’t feel great if I’m forced into an indoor situation (e.g. having to occasionally go into the office for my job), because I’m increasing my risk against my own choices, but it’s not that I’m more scared of being outside my home. One of the few tiny silver linings about my family just having had Covid is that we feel safe in taking my toddler to an indoor aquarium for the first time as we have a short window of immunity from the infection. I feel sad that until now the calculus of risk has prevented us doing that.
This. Also the reason why unpopular opinion type threads are often full of incredibly popular opinions.
Shit take by Alice, would like to point out she won't fly because "room tilt" but people looking at data that says you've got a 20% chance of (semi?)permanent cognitive reduction are the irrational ones.
Not really, 20% is about your chance of getting any form of long-term symptoms (defined as 12 weeks or more) after a covid infection, not specifically permanent cognitive reduction.
Still bad, don't get me wrong, but not all cases are that serious
So this research is very good and damming. I'm not stressing a percent, but I wonder if it says what percent get cognitive decline. Sorry, I'm definitely not arguing.
It says, essentially, everyone. If you got no respiratory symptoms it's approx an IQ point on average. If you were on a ventilator it's 7 points and hospitalisation isn't much better.
I did see one with percentage points but I'll need to dredge it up.
Ya I read it as approximate estimate overall as well. Honestly you don't need to kill yourself finding the other study. Honestly I'm fully on board with long covid being terrible. Thanks for the time to find research, comrade.
It's safer to get covid now than it was at the start of the pandemic. The problem is that it's still very much a health hazard and we are going to be getting it repeatedly for the rest of our lives. It's not going to burn itself out by returning to normal and getting everyone infected all the time.
Its not going to burn itself out, period. China tried a full-blown at-all-costs lockdown and they kept a lid on it for years. But they couldn't eliminate it. Highly contagious diseases that casually skip across boarders in asymptomatic careers aren't something you can just make go away.
The class war angle is simply the defunding of health care services for the majority of the Western public. It has far less to do with COVID specifically than any kind of treatment or prevention for every form of medical care. You can't quarantine your way out of that kind of problem.
At minimum we need to do as much as we can to limit the spread in public indoor areas, filtration/ventilation and masks essentially, and give people sick time to isolate.
The pictures from DAVOS - rapid tests, HEPA filters, ultraviolet lights, on staff medical - really illustrated the disparity afforded "elites" relative to everyone else.
Every Fortune 500 CEO who thinks they deserve this treatment but the rest of us don't deserves :gui-better:
Hey everybody let's maybe not listen to this dropout who has unmatchable privilege when it comes to not being affected by the pandemic in total and whose role in society is going 'oh damn that's messed up' for a podcast
She can have a condescending pat on the head when she's not taking the side of functional eugenics but she can't have one today.
Hey everybody let’s maybe not listen to this dropout who has unmatchable privilege when it comes to not being affected by the pandemic in total and whose role in society is going ‘oh damn that’s messed up’ for a podcast
i would subtweet this at her but I don't use the bird site
dsa twitter (idk if that's the correct term for it) has such a big ableism problem
the entire internet has become a confessional booth for white 1st world petit-bourgeois people who want to admit that capitalism is bad and then not do anything about it.
What the fuck is a 'judgemental' understanding of a disease? I thought lawyers were supposed to have functional vocabularies.
The sort of christian morality "if you got sick or something bad happened to you its your fault" which is INCREDIBLY prevalent from all of the people who manage to WFH and never leave their house (which is, in and of itself, a form of privilege. Im immunocompromised but I have to leave the house to make ends meet, which she mentions.) Sone people on this site have tried to dress up this language in faux-leftist drivel to make it a Socialist Position, too.
Zero COVID and successful "moving on from COVID as endemic" are literally the same thing if one's sane. The same way "living with cancer in the world" and "zero cancer" would be. Aiming to eliminate it entirely if possible while suppressing it as much as possible if not. When people say they're moving on from COVID what they're actually doing is regressing to a mindset that thinks it's 2019 and made literally 0 changes based on the new material conditions. "Moving on" needs to have new behaviours and yet the only new behaviours I can see are people are more willing in spreading diseases amongst each other now.
What's your point?
Aiming to eliminate it entirely if possible while suppressing it as much as possible if not.
Well that didn't happen. The only country that seriously tried was China and they had to capitulate in the end because they were on their own. The fact of the matter is that while covid the disease is not over, the response to it as a natural disaster is. Governments no longer care. It's just going to push up the baseline mortality and disability rates and that's it. We have a new thing that could kill us or disable us unexpectedly in life.
Government is just the ecosystem we organize in. Governments dropped the ball. We can still fight from where we are. We can win filtering in the workplace, sick-leave, and work from home if we organize our workplaces.
That sounds really hard and like I cant simply do it on my own while maintaining a headspace of Moral Supremacy >:/
Who is being materialist here? The one talking about what is actually happening, or the one talking about what should have happened?
Wanna' thank the mods for removing my posts here. Not sure why, but I know you know better than me. I'm glad you let the deppresso-nihilist COVID-spreader keep his excellent posts up too. Their posts are so good.
We’re on our own now. World governments completely failed.
We can still organize. We can organize our workplaces for air filtering, sick leave and work from home. We can go door to door and win ballot initiatives that get those wins mandated.
Shelling up at home isn't a socialist response to the pandemic. It takes the liberal insistence on individual responsibility at face value. The socialist response is to organize for the measures we know keep us safer.
Leave your home or don’t, wear a mask or don’t
We're in the middle of a pandemic, for a virus that propagates through respiratory aerosols. Regardless of what your government does, you should wear N95s. They don't just protect you from others, they also protect others from you.
So no, it's not "wear a mask or don't". It's "wear a mask or you're irresponsible".
honestly things have been ruined by insisting on the "don't infect others" surgical mask, instead of pushing for n95/ffp2 masks with the selfish "don't get infected" message
pandemic has shown that people don't give no fuck about people
Gotta have that nuance front and center so you can't get accused of lying
