https://www.nytimes.com/2024/07/01/us/politics/us-bases-alert-level-russia.html
https://archive.ph/laVgN
Even the US' intelligence apparatus is a bunch of Putin shills now
But seriously, no shit lmao. Did libs really think Putin was gonna try and pull an Ögedei Khan and try to take Europe?
They literally think the Russian brainpan is incapable of comprehending democracy due to them assimilating Mongolo-Asiatic authoritarianism genes in the time they were under Mongol rule so probably, yeah.
I heard literal this take ex cathedra in university in Poland. 30 years ago.
Damn. I haven't heard this one in uni but I had a professor who was casually peddling Spengler and some other sus figures.
Missed all the fun being out for the evening. I just want to inform you that I am not even exaggerating for comedic purposes that much, here is a random video found by typing "mongol influence on russian culture" on google and clicking the video tab. It features bangers such as "It has been several hundred years in their genetic inheritance that authoritarianism is the only solution".
https://youtu.be/5F45i0v_u6s?t=234
I found a YouTube link in your comment. Here are links to the same video on alternative frontends that protect your privacy:
Lol, this guy's entire post history is just him popping into random Hexbear threads to tell us how stupid he thinks we are and then refusing to engage anyone because he thinks we're too stupid for it to be worth his time. A very serious intellectual.
Have you read the comments in here? Lmao where do you guys come up with this nonsense?
be specific
if you're referring to the specific thing about Asians (and Russians in particular) having some inherent desire for authoritarian figures, I have personally seen this idea in the book Everything Flows by Vasily Grossman.
Oh, man, I hate Vasily Grossman. Life and Fate is on my shortlist for most overhyped book ever.
I actually kinda liked Everything Flows, the first half at least. The second half descends very quickly into incoherent anti-Russian/Soviet rants but the vignette about the Old Bolshevik being sent to the labor camp was very moving.
Replying to a comment is not specific enough an example for you? Do you think I'm referring to a random comment in a different post or something?
Okay, so what about the comment do you take issue with? Do you not believe it is a widely-disseminated idea in the west that Russians & Asians are inherently predisposed toward authoritarianism?
if you're referring to the specific thing about Asians (and Russians in particular) having some inherent desire for authoritarian figures, I have personally seen this idea in the book Everything Flows by Vasily Grossman.
Is this a good enough reply? Why not engage with that part of their comment?
Like you’ve never heard a harebrained pundit draw a line through the tsars, the evil Soviets, and Putin to conclude “these people simply can not know our enlightened values”
Could you be more specific? Our asiatic brainpans don't handle vague, nonspecific insults well.
Don't be vague.
Air your specific objections so we can respond to them or get ready to get pig-poop-balled.
Have you read the comments on
?It got so bad the mods banned using 'Orcs' as the term to refer to Russians with in the early days of the war. And many redditors cried about that.
We can argue the semantics of what exact type of dehumanizing language was used, but the overarching point remains.
Why in the world would I poison my eyes by going to that sub? Or even reddit at all.
Then what's your complaint here, exactly? People are shitposting and being somewhat hyperbolic, but a lot of liberals have considered Russians subhuman morons since at least the beginning of this war
Why would you need to go to reddit when you could just browse your own post history
at least attempt a specific criticism instead of just being vaguely contrarian it's annoying
Is that a good enough example for you, Di Vinci?
please give us your answer for who you think is responsible for the NordStream 2 bombing so we can laugh at it
I don't see why anyone is even bothering engaging this person with good faith. They're just "trolling" the same way people did back decades ago. Adding "lol" or "lmao" on to everything to pretend they're not upset, not reading anything, calling everyone stupid no matter what is said, always saying "I'm sitting here laughing at you" to again pretend they're not upset. They all ended up being incels and I wouldn't be surprised if this is no different
Look at that username, 100% chance this person is either an incel, or an edgy teenager who will become an incel.
Hello I'm a fellow
good germanliberal and I don't want to be infected with commie nonsense, can you point out the nonsense please so I can avoid it?
just ban these delusional trashlib already, after countless attempts at engagement all this idiot has ever done is smugly laugh and pretend he's smarter than everyone else.
I particularly love the fact that libs simultaneously believe that Russia is on a brink of collapse and about to roll over Europe as soon as it's done with Ukraine. They see no contradiction there.
Did libs really think Putin was gonna try and pull an Ögedei Khan and try to take Europe?
Yes. You should see the bullshit the European media keeps shoveling.
I barely even read any Polish media since 2022, they went into high gear of being unbearable and keeps at it ever since.
It's completely identical under PO. Russophobia is universal in Polish public spaces.
Being elevated by the USSR and the People's Republic really made their fascists mald didn't it?
Yes, we got propelled to modernity by socialism and they will never forgive it for that.
Well I'm malding over 1989 and the round table... Jesus I'll fucking never forgive them for what they've done to NFZ and well, the entire country...
Did libs really think Putin was gonna try and pull an Ögedei Khan and try to take Europe?
They did unironically think that, yes.
Did libs really think Putin was gonna try and pull an Ögedei Khan and try to take Europe
they definitely do here in europe
in February of 2022 Biden said that he was trying to reestablish the Soviet Union.
He has also said that he is proud to have been the first black woman to serve with a black president.
In general, I would not associate Biden with the word 'intelligence'.
And yeah, no, if Putin was trying to reestablish the USSR, he would be much better than he is. An anti-colonial power that massively improves its people's lives? Sign me up.
I wasn't referring to his commentary on intelligence, I was referring to his commentary on "the libs"
Considering that Biden is a lib, your reply, at best, supports the comment that you were replying to.
Furthermore, you seem to think that this point about Biden somehow contradicts the fact that 'NY Times just casually dropped that the official U.S. intelligence assessment has always been that Putin didn't want to expand the Ukraine conflict beyond Ukraine'
I didn't comment on the post to refute it, I replied to a comment to refute the comment. that's how threads work. anyway
comment: "Did libs really think Putin was gonna try and pull an Ögedei Khan and try to take Europe?"
me: this lib certainly said he thought so.
that's how conversations work.
He also said he'd seen photographic proof that Hamas had decapitated 40 babies.
He also said he would cure cancer, I am not joking.
this lib certainly said he thought so.
Most of us are pretty skeptical he actually did think so, especially considering a lot of experts in his circle have said things that contradict it. Case in point: the article being discussed.
I didn't comment on the post to refute it, I replied to a comment to refute the comment
And all you did is support - not refute - the comment. Just as I said here:
Considering that Biden is a lib, your reply, at best, supports the comment that you were replying to
comment: "Did libs really think Putin was gonna try and pull an Ögedei Khan and try to take Europe?"
me: this lib certainly said he thought so.Case in point.
He also managed to mumble this out during the debate a week ago, too. However, we can't be sure Biden even knows what year it is, so it's unclear if he still believes this hilarious lie or if he thinks it's 2022.
Ögedei didn't even tried to take Europe, it was a really big scout party which casually obliterated every army they encountered, arrived at Hungary, seen the pushta and considered staying because it reminded them of home and then went back because khan died and new one had to be elected. In the meantime collective Europe was thrown into a state of abject terror not known since Attila the Hun. But of course as soon as it passed, islamophobia kicked in, they started to blabber about Prester John and tried to use Mongols against muslims.
Still not as embarrassing as
admitting the Minsk agreements were all just to buy time for Ukraine.The original narratives about Ukraine no longer matter, the only thing left in the collective consciousness is Ukraine is a democracy therefore the war is about "western values". The good thing is since then even a good part liberals don't care about that anymore, its impossible to manufacture a narrative that Ukraine is winning right now, at best they "resisting" evil Putler and Zelensky does nothing but beg for more aid.
The Western media's admission of the deceitful nature of their narrative exposed liberals, who mindlessly parrot the same talking points despite the revelations, as nothing more than gullible buffoons.
I don't think liberals could have had a worse week. The cracks in their dome are apparent and aren't going away. Some people are checking out, some people are saying "enough" to the constant stream of bullshit right to their faces. /R/politics is a hoot right now.
But do they change anything about their approach? Of course not.
I expect that at some point the whole house of cards is going to come crashing down.
i might have thought so a few years back but now i feel like there is no end to their ability to mental contortion and gymnastics
I mean, for them to stop believing in their ideology, they'd have to find something else to believe in. What would that even be? Most of them are probably innoculated against ideas left of Mussolini due to the constant government programming happening on reddit, so they'd either become anarchobidenists and believe 95% of the same things by saying to themselves "anarchism is when you hate authoritarian governments (read: governments who are resistant to being totally rolled over by American monopolies) and love western democracies. who the fuck is kropotkin? gelderloos? I'm listening to a 3 hour video essay by a breadtuber"
or, I guess, they'd turn even further conservative and/or libertarian and start frothing at the mouth about the federal reserve and age of consent laws
In my observations on Libs, I think the biggest challenge for them is that they fundamentally trust the institutions that govern our society. In order to believe in something else, they would have to break that trust on a fundamental level. But that trust underpins their entire worldview, so in doing so they would not only have to fundamentally alter their core values, but also in doing to have to admit that they have been wrong about everything their entire lives. That's a pretty tall order.
I'd argue that mainstream libs represent the segment of the population that still hasn't been significantly affected materially. They still have their jobs, they can pay their bills, and there really hasn't been any dramatic change in their lifestyle. They also tend to stay in their bubble avoiding interaction with people who are struggling. This segment of the population is rapidly shrinking though, and we can see them starting to freaking out that their voices are increasingly challenged nowadays. It's a huge shock for them that their narrative can't spread unchallenged.
They're gonna continue to childishly point fingers at everyone else. "All the mistakes I have made and continue to make are because of the chyna-ruzzia-woke-tankie-bots"
No, it was always this way. We always knew this. The way the government is admitting things are is the same as what they've been saying all along. Your left-wing views always make you say paranoid stuff like this. This is not an unexpected departure from the official line. The only people who were trying to scare us about how Europe could be invaded next were misinformed marginal figures, not the actual authority figures who always had a reassuring firm grip and level gaze toward reality. If it were really a big change then someone would make a big deal about it, and I don't see anybody making a fuss.
lol who told you that
"He has much larger ambitions than Ukraine. He wants to, in fact, reestablish the former Soviet Union. That's what this is about." -President Joe Biden, February 24, 2022.
he trotted this out at the disastrous debate last week too. blows my mind the kind of bullshit people can tolerate
this isn't even about tolerating, this guy just completely made this claim up that no Democratic leader claimed Putin wanted to go beyond ukraine. and people just upvoted them without even looking at it
Okay you're having a lot of trouble so I will help you out here: my initial comment was sarcasm or parody or whatever you want to call it.
You might want to check out the hidden gem eighteen fourty nine by JoJo Joestar.
Reminds me of the Bush defenders who pretended his administration never said Saddam had a hand in Sept. 11.
I wish I could be amused my lemmy liberals taking this seriously
The shit about world conqueror Putin reached my, decidedly non American lib parents. This shit is bananas
If you use an ounce of critical thinking it was always clear NATO wants a war with Russia, not the other way around.
To be fair, if you use an ounce of critical thinking then you stop being a liberal.
Yeah, no shit. These pathetic
vassals don’t care though, they’ll keep throwing money down the pit of “increased defense spending because NATO wants it”.Is that how you read it? In my head their username is "Yog-... Is that even an o? y- ahhh fuck it, the cosmonaut"
I thought they were letters from another alphabet or something, had no idea they were just another font.
It's the thing where similar-looking letters are taken from other alphabets to make fancy looking letters. The not-O there is a Greek letter, for example, specifically I think it's lowercase Sigma.
Ironically, given Yog is a Russophone and people do this with Cyrillic all the time, much to the chagrin of those who can read Cyrillic.
A very mean, and sometimes fun, trick to play on others in a collaborative programming environment is to randomly replace semicolons with Greek question marks and watch them slowly descend into madness during debugging.
Captcha: Type these letters (and its just ones, capital I's and lowercase l's in that font where they all look the same)
The not-O there is a Greek letter, for example, specifically I think it's lowercase Sigma
As a person with a math degree (meaning that I'm an expert on the Greek alphabet), I confirm, that is lowercase sigma.
i just go by the avatars for pretty much any user who has one lol
Death to America
if i were a lemm.ee (لا سمح الله) and I saw this thread and the idiots that post here I would delete my account out of shame
Look. We HAVE to shoot up a grocery store in order to stop the Soviets. It’s for the greater good.
Wait, but that would mean all the libs saying that Putin would invade everyone if he wins in Ukraine were brainwashed liars???
I'm not trying to get flamed as a lib here, but there's a gulf of difference between "not wanting to expand the war" and "having no further ambition once the war is over"
There is no indication that Russia has any military ambitions past Ukraine, and it's pretty clear that Russia tried very hard to prevent the situation in Ukraine from devolving into a war.
I'm not arguing either of these points, I'm just pointing out that all NYT is saying here is that US officials have always believed that Russia wants this war to stay contained to Ukraine. Not that they think Russia didn't want this war or that Russia doesn't have other interests it will pursue external to this war.
All I'm saying is NYT didn't really reveal anything here.
There are plenty of people running around saying that once Russia wins in Ukraine than it's going to go on a conquest of Europe. This has been one of the major justifications for continuing the war lately.
That's true, but that does imply that this war would conclude first. Which is consistent with saying Russia does not want this conflict to expand beyond Ukraine.
I mean... That's true in that Russia tried to win before Ukraine could mount a significant resistance. Attacking in the first place was pretty clearly an act of war, though, so it feels a bit disingenuous to claim Russia wanted to avoid a war when they... Started... A war...
All it really says is that Russia thought they were strong enough to steamroll Ukraine. Actually wanting to avoid a war would look a lot more like never attacking in the first place or retreating when faced with actual resistance.
Actually wanting to avoid a war would look a lot more like never attacking in the first place
Okay, so, consider this: the most prolific aggressor in the world, one which has been carrying out invasions around the world, inducing crises, enacting coups, killing millions, and which has broken its promise to not expand to your border, carried out a coup in a neighbouring country and is trying to set up a military force there against you in a blatant act of aggression. What do you do?
Apparently, you invade with ineptitude that would be hilarious if not for the bloodshed, embarrass yourself on the world stage, commit a whole bunch of war crimes, and drive several of your neighbors into the arms of this enemy. It's not what I'd do, but Putin seemed to think it was the move to make.
Apparently, you invade with ineptitude that would be hilarious if not for the bloodshed, embarrass yourself on the world stage, commit a whole bunch of war crimes, and drive several of your neighbors into the arms of this enemy
I'm sorry, I thought that you weren't this delusional about Afghanistan somehow fitting the description I provided. No, kid, Afghanistan didn't expand to any US border, and is not the word's most prolific aggressor that killed millions of people during its second invasion of Iraq alone.
In any case, I'm going to note that you did refuse to give an answer to the question, are fine with committing war crimes (in particular, with Ukraine using cluster bombs on its own populated areas), and you seem to think that Sweden and Finland weren't already de facto NATO states, despite their prior participation in NATO atrocities.
It's not what I'd do
Well, we are still waiting for you to tell us what you would do. After all, you seem to think that you are qualified to tell the rest of the world how it should resist you and how it should react to your aggression.
I’m sorry, I thought that you weren’t this delusional about Afghanistan somehow fitting the description I provided. No, kid, Afghanistan didn’t expand to any US border, and is not the word’s most prolific aggressor that killed millions of people during its second invasion of Iraq alone.
I'm sorry, I thought you understood we were talking about Ukraine, so I interpreted your comment through that lens. I've heard claims that the 2014 was western-backed, though I've never seen anyone attempt to substantiate that claim, so I assumed that was what you meant. You know, because it's relevant to the discussion at hand, unlike Afghanistan.
Well, we are still waiting for you to tell us what you would do. After all, you seem to think that you are qualified to tell the rest of the world how it should resist you and how it should react to your aggression.
Go ahead and quote the part where I said anything about how they should or shouldn't resist. I never did, nor was that the topic at hand. Attempting to force me to answer it is nothing but an attempt at grandstanding.
The discussion at hand, since you seem to be struggling to grasp that, was whether or not Russia was trying to prevent war in Ukraine. Ukraine being the country they invaded. Voluntarily. Arguably for imperialist reasons. Unless, of course, you think it's pure coincidence that Russia would stand to gain ports, natural gas (or is it oil? I think natural gas), and a ton of food production.
I'm sorry, I thought you understood we were talking about Ukraine
We were, but you decided to talk about your embarrassment and atrocities in Afghanistan, for some reason.
I've heard claims that the 2014 was western-backed, though I've never seen anyone attempt to substantiate that claim
The Nuland-Pyatt correspondence where they discussed whom to put on the throne in Ukraine instead of the then-current leader were leaked in early February of 2014, before the coup. She also bragged about how much the US spent on influencing the Ukrainian government. And, of course, the leaders of the coup were politicians - it was not a grassroots movement.
Go ahead and quote the part where I said anything about how they should or shouldn't resist
You keep talking about how Russia is bad for resisting you, for example.
I never did, nor was that the topic at hand
It's literally the topic at hand. You started it by talking about how Russia shouldn't have resisted your aggression the way Russia did.
Attempting to force me to answer it is nothing but an attempt at grandstanding
Cool. So, what you said is that Russia responded correctly to your aggression. Good to know that you will now delete your cold comments now that you realise that you were in the wrong.
The discussion at hand, since you seem to be struggling to grasp that, was whether or not Russia was trying to prevent war in Ukraine
War with NATO more generally.
And yeah, Russia did try to resolve it otherwise. Russia did not just do an overt full-scale invasion in 2014.
Ukraine being the country they invaded
After NATO did a coup in Ukraine and set up a puppet government there that was attempting to bring NATO's weapons to the Russian border.
Voluntarily
Cool. So what would you do? Let the most prolific aggressor in the world harass and attack you? Lol.
Notably, you are fine with voluntarily invading Iraq, Afghanistan, Libya, Vietnam, Korea, committing genocides, including the one in the occupied Palestine, known torture sites, coups, etc.
Reads like projection, especially considering how the NATO freaks have been publicly salivating over those dumbassed balkanized Russia maps and publicly posting their plans via military think tanks
