EDIT: no, I don't sympathize with nazis (neither I sympathize with those who call everyone nazi when they're losing an argument ;)
defederate to maintain your very special echo chamber
defederate to stop sh.tjust.works chuds from harassing your comrades in DMs with violent, transphobic and ableist attackslol its this shit every time libs see a legitimate left stance. im assuming you’ve seen the sh.itjust.works defed post. its like 5 super vocal users having a conniption fit that there are communists on the internet
Hah. As if anyone could be more angry at communists on the internet than other communists on the internet.
This post assumes that a meaningful amount of defed instances are caused by simple lack of agreement. Often, it's an orthogonal matter - it boils down to instance A actually understanding something about the userbase of instance B and saying "I'm not dealing with this shit, it'll make the instance worse for its own users". For example: the typical user of B might be disingenuous, or preach immoral prescriptions, behave like a chimp, or be a bloody stupid piece of trash that should've stayed in Reddit to avoid smearing its stupidity everywhere here.
Are instance admins too eager to pull the trigger for defed? Perhaps, in some cases; specially because it handles groups of users instead of individuals. But those cases are better addressed through actual examples, not through a meme talking on generic grounds.
For example: the typical user of B might be disingenuous, or preach immoral prescriptions, behave like a chimp, or be a bloody stupid piece of trash that should've stayed in Reddit to avoid smearing its stupidity everywhere here.
lemm.ee, SJW, programming dev,
really anyone who isn't lemmygrad, Hexbear, or some of lemmy
Ive seen enough cool people from lemm.ee that I'm alright with them
LOL a tankie (read: genocide denialist) talking about some genocide denial? That's what I am referencing dipshit, both of you have the tendency to do the same, you just pick and choose which genocides to deny. Go fist your own dickhole.
Liberals when someone denies white genocide: 😡
Liberals when someone denies the Holocaust: 😍
Really going mask off there.
https://jewishcurrents.org/the-double-genocide-theory
Wtf? Is that where your brain goes? Like genuinely, seek help.
This is a pretty controversial position. I am willing to compromise. I don't especially care how they die. I'll abide other methods
"im a bit of a centrist on the matter, on the one hand throwing them into the pit is pretty good, but the firing squad people make a good point"
You can’t enter a discussion with somebody who’s just trying to bombard you into submission. OP is wildly ignorant or just somebody sad they’re being defederated on a different account.
The marketplace of ideas is only okay if they're ideas I agree with!
Funny how one instance is the one everyone wants to defederate from.
Lol is that why hexbear is defederating from so many instances?
Any instance not arguing in good faith gets removed normally.
Why so much drama over fed or defed, just change instances if you don't agree with your admin
I think where that falls down is if a big community is in X instance, the instance admins have control over that instance
Doesn't matter what instance you switch to if the communities you participate in are under that instance's control
Not saying that's a huge problem yet but it could turn into one and then we get powermods all over again
Currently. Of course in the past it was exploding heads for being Nazis, Lemmygrad for being insufferable tankies, then Burggit for lolicon, now hexbear for being insufferable tankies.
When everyone you meet is an asshole, you are probably the real asshole.
Funny how this works with social media as well.
"you say you don't like intolerance and yet that sounds like intolerance to me"
*smug face*
neither I sympathize with those who call everyone nazi when they're losing an argument ;)
Oh hey, look, it's the same thought terminating argument that the alt-right uses to whitewash Nazis!
Hey look its the same thought terminating argument tankies use when they want to bring about purges for "wrong think".
It's so cute when one of you is obviously just pulling out whatever scary Orwell words you remember from 8th grade english class
If the 'thing you dont agree' with is hate speech or shit promotting violence for example that's the only sane option you have lol
Here's a comment thread where a Hexbear user said "I hope to kill people like you" because I simply said I supported democratic socialism.
Going on any Hexbear instance people froth over telling anyone right of Karl Marx to "get up against the wall". You guys are, and will always be, a joke.
You said you supported Social Democracy not Democratic Socialism. Dem Socs are well-meaning but idealistic, not optimistic but the political philosophy of idealism. Soc Dems are supporters of a kinder capitalism for the Imperial core but keeping the child slaves mining cobalt in the Congo.
The fact that you think these are the same proves the original posters point that you should read theory. They were harsh but you were implying that keeping exploitation of the third world is preferable to socialism.
Dude you still don’t stop worker exploitation, don’t solve the contradiction of working and capitalist classes, don’t end imperialism or colonialism (social democracy outsources exploitation to the third world)
Ok let me know how your method works out
You said you supported Social Democracy not Democratic Socialism.
What a terrible mistake to make! Perhaps you should have assumed it was the correct orientation of the two words that are spelled exactly the same.
The fact that you think these are the same proves the original posters point that you should read theory.
I have, but thanks for the suggestion.
youre getting into arguments where you don't know what the words mean, and then acting indignant when people point that out
Assuming people are using words in the way they are widely and commonly accepted to mean (I mean, just look at Wikipedia for an easy starting point) is not a bad thing?
I'm innudated with endless notifications from you dweebs, mistakes happen.
I'm innudated with endless notifications from you dweebs, mistakes happen.
People keep telling me that I shit my pants based off the way I smell and the growing brown stain on my pants but they're all tankies because they're all wrong
What incredible insight. The word 'social' is referring to 'socialism' and so is the relation between 'democracy' and 'democratic'.
It would take an idiot to mix these up, right?
The word 'social' is referring to 'socialism' and so is the relation between 'democracy' and 'democratic'.
I guess social security = socialism security in your world? Social welfare programs are not socialism and if your political education included anything beyond Elizabeth Warren's policy page you'd know that.
What a terrible mistake to make! Perhaps you should have assumed it was the correct orientation of the two words that are spelled exactly the same.
Your beef is with the English Language not me. How is it my fault that you misidentified yourself? Funnily enough, you still don't identify your actual political position. It's clear that the only political position you'd take is what gives you an advantage in the argument. Fucking debatebros lol.
I have, but thanks for the suggestion.
Reading so much theory that you confuse two different political ideologies. Sometimes I read so much theory that that I claim to be a monarchist when I really mean to say I'm an anti-monarchist. Obviously the other person should have understood what I meant. Your literally on a communication medium that allows you to plan and edit your comments. You have no excuse for making this grade school mistake.
Debatebro? That's what Hexbear does best.
I would actually love to engage in good faith discussions, but Hexbear users only operate in bad faith, particularly by sealioning. Like clockwork, you don't engage in ideas but rather give reading assignments.
I've read Das Kapital and agree with virtually all the premises about how society is unfair to those who actually generate the surplus value and think that we need to fix a system that breaks cyclically, as Karl Marx correctly predicted in volume I. The only solutions I've seen presented are a total revolution a la 1917, which occured before globalization. Anything close to this in the current globalized world will kill at minimum hundreds of millions globally due to interdependence on products that Marx would consider "needs", such as medications and medical equipment like dialysis machines.
The difference between you and me is that I'd rather work to reestablish democracy away from capital interests. I don't want a dictatorship, I want a functional democracy. Propaganda is often used to disillusion the working class from democracy, and if you don't vote in elections then you are clearly part of the problem.
Edit: Lmao. Citing"theory" gets crickets from the people who endlessly say "you just haven't read theory". It's like they don't know what to do with someone who reads to understand, rather than "reading" just to virtue signal.
Debatebro? That's what Hexbear does best.
Hahaha, literally "I know you are but what am I"
reading" just to virtue signal.
Lmao peak angry chud solipsism. "I would never read except to lord it over others, so that must be what these commies are doing."
If course you would, like a good little authoritarian.
In my ideal society I’d give people like you the freedom you deserve.
This you?
Haha, classic Catradora_Stalinism, what a rascal.
She's probably like 16 dude chill and welcome to the Internet where people fling the most unhinged nonsense at each other without a second thought
An aggressive communist with no sense of how the world works could be a child? You're the most self aware Hexbear user.
Also lol to "dude chill". I'm not the one fantasizing about murdering people.
Nah the capitalist system you cheer for murders people just fine, Mr. Welfare-capitalism-is-actually-socialism
She's not here, do you want me to pop into that thread and chastise her for you?
My mind just boggles at the fact that anyone is taking this two bit reddit clone seriously enough to carry a grudge longer that the lifespan of a single thread.
welcome to the Internet where people fling the most unhinged nonsense at each other without a second thought
TIL I am internetting wrong lol.
For me personally, flinging unhinged shit at other users is tiring. I find it much easier to either be nice or abandon ship
because I simply said I supported democratic socialism.
so you promoted violence first?
i'm failing to see your complaint hereI support what are realistic policies actually will push the status quo in the direction you want.
Larping on the internet waiting for a revolution to occur seems like a nice fantasy.
There are numerous democratic socialists who are in Congress, you just aren't paying attention.
Run for office. There have been many spoilers from genuine grassroots campaigns. Don't want to do either? Keep coping and seething online.
The master's tools will never dismantle the master's house. Entryism always ends up changing the entrant instead of the system. We are revolutionary socialists.
I too support democratic socialism
Allende just needed more people's militias
So socialism, if it has any degree of democracy to it, which is kind of essential to socialism, is evil in your eyes.
What version of decision making is acceptable in socialism then?
Just one party rule?
Extreme violence is still violence. Industrial violence on a massive scale is still violence. You are advocating for violence, terrible violence, and then getting upset someone else advocated for comparatively mild violence.
Defederation is becoming the Lemmy meme.
I think being on lemmy does not in any way oblige a user to listen to everyone all the time. A lot of people will just come here for a good time. And for the freedom of speech activists: freedom of speech also involves other peoples freedom not to want to listen.
Moreover, I think most people who want to defederate with certain instances don’t necessarily have a problem with different world views, but have a problem with the tone being set by a small percentage of the users of said instances. Unfortunately, only a small percentage is needed to create a general vibe.
I hope it will be possible for individual users to block entire instances very soon, this way this whole debate will become obsolete. Personally, I can’t wait for it (the debate to become obsolete, not blocking instances necessarily)
Also freedom of speech is between your government and you. Your government can't censor speech, private companies, individuals, organizations, ect, can censor your speech or censor themselves from hearing it. All rights are only between an individual and their government.
The private property rights that give private companies the ability to censor your speech are created and inforced by the government in the first place, so functionally it's not different. A handful of massive companies who functionally own the government getting to police what is acceptable speech is not functionally different from the government doing it directly.
Oh absolutely, taken in a greater context which I totally neglected to say that's absolutely true.
The blocking instances thing won't necessarily solve this problem.
You might be able to block posts from an instance but not comments or votes.
Blocking votes is not a concern, but it’s the comment toxicity that is (in my opinion) making this place lose something very special.
IDK, I think brigading / vote manipulation has more of an impact than most realise.
this but unironically. please defederate from us
Death to America
Many instances have shit like hexbear federated, but have explicit rules on the side saying "no tankie shit". make it make sense.
Tankies aren't real Communists
Sucking the dick of authoritarian regimes does not make you communist
Heaven forbid an actually existing place on the planet actually make some real tangible gains for its people while necessarily suppressing threats
There's "threats" and there's "anyone remotely criticising the regime"
There are some tangible gains in these places but also significant losses for the freedoms and rights of their residents
Hell yeah there's that lib homophobia, 1 milimeter below the surface at all times
I'm bi but no go ahead, call me a homophobe for making a dick joke :p
Then you should know better than to be homophobic as a substitute for saying anything interesting. Self-reflection would probably help you to not embarass yourself in the future.
Why does it always go to homophobia with these types
Idk where the homophobia is, I'm partial to sucking the odd dick myself, just not Mao Zedong or Vladimir Putin :p
"umm actually I used it as an insult because it's a good thing!"
How do you people survive the cognitive dissonance necessary to convince yourself you're not being bigoted?
"you people"?
Besides, I'm not bigoted because I disagree with your ideology, my way of pointing that out may have been hyperbolic but certainly not bigoted
Yeah, you people, people who used homophobic insults about dick sucking but insist it's ok because they're gay/bi/have an LGBT friend.
I agree that you're not bigoted because you disagree with our ideology, but you are definitely bigoted for using bigoted insults to point it out.
I'm not communist, but I do observe that many of the existing "communist" states seem to be just authoritarianism disguised as the common good
All nation states are authoritarian disguised as the common good.
yeah, exactly. which raises the question of why china specifically infuriates certain people to the exclusion of all other discussion.
Real Communism exists only in the pure and untouched ethereal plane of your mind palace.
Real communism also only exists within the walls of the Kremlin.
http://english.sse.com.cn/
Celebrating an increase in life expectancy from 30 to 40 years old is not remotely the win you think it is.
I'm celebrating the increase in life expectancy from 35 to higher than that of the US, actually, which is the win I think it is.
The point is not the immediate increase in that specific 5 year period, the point is the clear trend of rapid, long term increases after a long period of stagnation, with the pivitol turning point being exactly when the CPC came to power. You're supposed to look at the whole graph.
China never manipulates data coming out of their authoritarian country so good thing we can trust it. I'm sure their life expectancy is great with all their industrial pollution that regularly causes smog in their inner cities.
Here is my source do you have a source that disputes that? Or is your belief based entirely on unfalsifiable faith?
Also curious if you think Chinese life expectancy is still like 35 or what lmao
You may also be interested in what the World Bank, that infamous communist propaganda rag, has to say:
Over the past 40 years, the number of people in China with incomes below $1.90 per day – the International Poverty Line as defined by the World Bank to track global extreme poverty– has fallen by close to 800 million. With this, China has contributed close to three-quarters of the global reduction in the number of people living in extreme poverty.
My god he can't read a graph. How has our educational system been allowed to fail for this long?
I'm not committed at all to China as the salvation of the communist project, but it's exactly this sort of self-imposed illiteracy and ignorance, and nearly religious faith in the inferiority and duplicity of The Orient that makes me default to distrusting anything negative a cracker says about it.
Comrade, I also blindly trust any graph as dear leader would have it.
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/0/00/Trump_holding_altered_Dorian_forecast_map.png/800px-Trump_holding_altered_Dorian_forecast_map.png
let's skip to the end of the discussion: I say "that's not anything like what I said." you say "yes but you believe those statistics are true???" I say "do you have any good evidence that they're fabricated, and that the life expectancy in China is actually still hovering around 40?" you beg the question, possibly implying that Chinese people are inherently untrustworthy, and accuse me of supporting genocide. There is nothing I can say to you that will instill an ounce of critical thinking ability in you.
Careful calling those regimes authoritarian. Hexbears like to attack this point by assigning a slightly different definition to authoritarian and then either (a) claim that all governments are "authoritarian" or (b) blame liberals for using this word to demonize socialist states. I once saw someone cite https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Authoritarianism to "prove" that those states are not authoritarian.
Not by "assigning a slightly different definition", just by applying the definition consistently, rather than using the
standard.Ah yes, doge-firefox, please tell me how consistent your beliefs are lmao
I strawmanned ad hominined logical fallacied all over them.
It's worse than just that. They argue that acknowledgement of Stalin's atrocities is Holocaust denial.
They are so scared and insecure they will lash out against anything that slightly challenges their beliefs. If they post sources it will be misreadings of fringe groups, or conveniently ignoring facts. Like how they believe tiananmen square wasn't a big deal because the China killed about 300 people a mile away. Or how Cuba is a utopia even though it's citizens chose to get run over by the coast guard instead of living there.
They argue that acknowledgement of Stalin's atrocities is Holocaust denial.
No, we argue that equating the bad things the soviet union did to the holocaust is holocaust trivialization, which is a take from mainstream liberal historians. Because the bad things the soviet union did were tiny compared to the holocaust and pretty tame compared to the other Allies.
As ever, actual Jewish Holocaust scholars agree with us
https://jewishcurrents.org/the-double-genocide-theory
Anticommunist
antisocial
Literally same thing lol
easy solution: your definition of tankie shit is so incredibly broad that it includes anything to the left of the US Democratic party
I think they're mainly quick to defederate because they don't want to burn out their mods.
Conflict and drama means lots of work for them so I can see it being an easy choice. Personally I'm happy my instance isn't too trigger happy with it
Forreal your instance might be the one I'm most confused by, you've got like a 50/50 split of chill people who are okay with conversation and people who drop slurs and reply to any attempt at engagement in memes and
gotcha one-liners.High percentage of Canadians and the 50/50 describes canada to a fucking T
Me when I find out about the canadians
You seem alright though
?
