If you have any useful resource links please tag me in a comment with the link.
Examples of racism/euro-centrism during the Russia-Ukraine conflict
Please add to this if you can.
Links
Time/Map: https://time.is/Ukraine
https://www.google.com/maps/place/Ukraine/@49.1162725,31.7993839,7z/data=!4m5!3m4!1s0x40d1d9c154700e8f:0x1068488f64010!8m2!3d48.379433!4d31.1655799?hl=en
Leftist discussion threads:
https://hexbear.net/post/177324
https://old.reddit.com/r/GenZedong/comments/t03foy/genzedong_russiaukraine_master_discussion_thread/
https://lemmygrad.ml/
Twitter military updaters:
https://nitter.net/ASBMilitary
https://nitter.net/Militarylandnet
https://nitter.net/MihajlovicMike
https://nitter.net/KofmanMichael
https://nitter.net/TadeuszGiczan/status/1498673348183744518
Global South Perspective: https://nitter.net/kiranopal_/status/1498723206496145413
Better war/propaganda analysis:
https://www.understandingwar.org
https://www.moonofalabama.org/
News updates:
https://www.cgtn.com/special/UkraineCrisis.html
Live: https://www.cgtn.com/special/Live-update-Ukraine-Russia-border-crisis.html
YT/Video in Ukraine:
https://www.youtube.com/c/PatrickLancasterNewsToday/videos
https://www.youtube.com/c/RussellBentleyTe
Thank you.
Previous megathreads:
So Russia has offered it's terms for ending the war: fully recognize Crimea and the Donbas republics and sign and agreement to not join "blocs" like the EU or NATO. Basically leaving a neutral state in Western Ukraine with the ethnic Russian parts as independent states or part of Russia proper. This would basically be the prewar status quo but officially and without the constant shooting and shelling in the Donbas, and Ukraine ceding the previously Ukrainian-held territory to Donbas republics. It's a pretty good deal tbh, but he probably can't take it out of fear of what the numerous fascist militants would do to him
The Ukrainian side has 1 less negotiator now compared to the last round. Different stories by all sides on what happened to him but he's dead.
Fascists don't want this to end. They will martyr the entire population if they can. They will collapse all of Europe and use the opportunities it opens up as states across the continent get resource-stretched to start new fascist territories.
They started with the demilitarization and denazification of the country lol.
Denazification implies occupation, it was always bs. demilitarization is/was feasible, if all sides didn’t bungle it so much it was even feasible before the war
True, denazification was what was used to drum up domestic support and boost morale in the DPR/LPR
I mean denazification could always be sold like 5 generals of azov were killed, mission accomplished, pack our troops, it’s that weak of a statement. Will the west/libs start trolling that they didn’t denazify? Of course not. That’s why it’s nebulousness is so useful
That's their justification for the invasion, sure, which is pretty dumb. But the Minsk agreements 8 years ago pretty much only required that Ukrainian provinces get self-determination and that Ukraine agree to neutrality, which unfortunately Ukraine never honored.
that's a great deal they should take it but the fascists absolutely won't let them.
what a hero, not taking the deal because of what would happen to 1 person. wow, just like Tony Stark.
Seems like a legit deal - also doesn't Russia suddenly just own a bunch of Ukraine's oil then? Like it is straight imperialism & a resource grab
They wouldn't own anything they don't already own. Crimea has been part of the Russian Federation for nearly a decade. They people there overwhelmingly do not want to be part of Ukraine.
Well there is the oilfield in Donetsk that is currently under Ukrainian control (or at least was at the start of the war)
That wouldn't be part of Russia, it would be part of the DPR. I'm sure a Russian company would extract it though, since oil extraction is very capital intensive and they don't have their own oil extraction outfit.
Oh I guess I was just assuming that they would vote to join Russia afterwards, but they might not
I mean maybe they will. There is genuine sentiment for joining Russia there. I'd like to see what happens there politically as an independent state, but it's not really my call lol.
That belongs to the people of Donetsk, not Russia. If they choose to sell it to Russia, that's their business.
Well, yes and no. The Donbas states would absolutely be Russian client states beholden to Russian goodwill.
Still, it's a pretty mild deal considering the stakes.
Okay and? That doesn't really change anything. Who else are they going to sell it to? Ukraine?
If they forgave the Ukranian state for murdering 14,000 of their people over 8 years, if it's even the same state later at the end of this war, then sure. That's their business as a self-determining state.
Sure it is in theory, but you can't really deny that Russia would have a lot of sway over the tiny state on its border that only really exists because of its military intervention.
I also can't deny that the imperialist states denies their existence and as such will force them to make deals where they can since they're not recognized as sovereign peoples republics.
No it's not.
Russia would have a lot of sway over the tiny state on its border that only really exists because of its military intervention.
Does not mean
the imperialist states denies their existence and as such will force them to make deals where they can
No, Russia acted because Ukraine's jingoistic government, that's extremely hostile to Russia, was demanding to join NATO and to become a nuclear power. The interests of the Donbass Republics to fight for their separation from the genocidal fascist-aligned Ukrainian state simply aligned with the Russian Federation's interest to not have a genocidal fascist-aligned Ukranian state enter into NATO and have the imperialist powers right at their door.
it's from reuters interview with peskov https://www.reuters.com/world/kremlin-says-russian-military-action-will-stop-moment-if-ukraine-meets-2022-03-07/
These have been the Russian demands for 8 years, that are scarily reasonable, and unfortunately Ukraine has never honoured.
I have no idea why the Ukrainian government would rather have a war than agree to neutrality and the ukrainian people getting self-determination. Doesn't justify the invasion, but, what a dumb thing to fight over.
Wikipedia editors changed "2014 Ukrainian revolution" to "Revolution of Dignity" :tito-laugh: Clown shit
“There are biological research facilities in Ukraine, and we fear that Russia will take control over them.” - U.S. Deputy Secretary of State Victoria Nuland at a congressional hearing
The US is working with Ukraine to prevent biological research facilities from falling into the hands of Russians — Nuland
Bruh, why this look so sus.
I feel just a little bad for anyone who watches the news all day and still thinks Ukraine is winning, but I kind of would like to see the gormless look on their face when this is over. Might make people question the media they consume. But I doubt it.
Ashamed to say but my boomer parents watch Tucker Carlson. Sitting down their on their recliners being spoon fed raw propaganda, and acting like little military generals:
“Putin, we gotta find out where he is and take him out!!”
It’s really fucking scary how easy it is to consume media in this country. You just sit down and it’s so convenient. It’s comfortable. It hits different when it’s your own parents as opposed to some psycho boomer chud going off on Facebook.
Fucking hate it here
Remember like 20 or 30 years ago when libs would ask "how could regular germans just go along with the nazis\fascism?" Well, just look around at them now :yea:
In 20 or 30 years they will say "Wow, how did people go along with the war. The propaganda was so obvious."
60% of those polled said they "never believed the US narrative regarding the war"
18 year old baby lefties will be saying "I would never fall for propaganda that obvious" and the wheel spins again
Can I just say how incredible it is that I haven't even heard once about the Biden family's connections to Ukrainian gas companies and the Hunter Biden Ukraine scandal
Love the responses saying "that was 25 years ago, so what? " and a guy unironically saying "Putler" if not stopped in Ukraine "will continue to Berlin"
Wtf is it with libs and these awful nicknames. Everything they hate trump for they embody
pretty weird to see him talking as if he has a fully functional brain :whywhywhywhywhy:
Oh. Oh no. Oh no no no.
During WWII, Ukrainian nationalists saw the Nazis as liberators from Soviet oppression. Now, Russia is using that chapter to paint Ukraine as a Nazi nation
This is the age we live in
edit:
From the Ukrainian side of the debate, the country’s wartime history is more complex. Are the nationalists “bad guys” because they participated in the Holocaust, Shevel asks, or “good guys” because they fought for independence?
:screm-a:
From the Soviet point of view that Putin still embraces, it’s simple, she says: The Holocaust aside, Ukrainian nationalists were “bad guys” because “they fought the Soviet state.”
Imagine ever writing the phrase "The Holocaust aside", jesus fucking christ.
aside from the planes flying into the buildings, it was a beautiful and clear tuesday morning in manhattan
From the Ukrainian side of the debate, the country’s wartime history is more complex.
"No bro they aren't Nazis, its a complex issue, you just don't understand. How is it complex? uhhhhh"
On the one hand they murdered Jews and Romas on an industrial scale but in the other hand they wanted to have some shitty right-wing dictatorship that was flying their flag so who can tell whether they were bad or not?
“Better (Jews, gays, the disabled, the poor, communists are) dead, than Red” - every liberal
AAAAAAAHAAAAHAAAAHAAHAAA:
https://www.reuters.com/article/factcheck-ukraine-cnn-idUSL2N2VB0UM
HAAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAAAHA
It’s always interesting to watch Putin interviews because while he is a committed anti-communist, he still has a materialist analysis of the world. It’s an interesting parallel to how western communists still think like capitalists, due to the ingrained value system taught when they were young
Insufferable liberal idea: going around to gas stations and putting Putin’s face over all the “I did that” stickers of Joe pointing to the gas prices that chuds have been putting up.
No, libs are not funny enough to think up something like that
I’m not above posting my posts https://hexbear.net/post/179163/comment/2225210
JUST IN - Saudi Arabia and the UAE declined to speak with Biden about countering Russia and containing a surge in oil prices, WSJ reports.
Still incredibly disheartening to find those brainworms your parents hold when discussing shit like this, convinced that Putin is just a communist lunatic restoring the glory of the USSR, NATO is just a 'purely defensive pact' and the Ukrainians are just so democratic and not committing warcrimes, unlike those bully Russians who are just committing genocide, it's like everything happening is happening in a vacuum.
ask them when the last time they thought about ukraine before 2022 was
ask them how often they put themselves in the shoes of their perceived enemies, not as a way of feeling sorry for their enemies, but as a way of understanding their motivations and strategies
ask them if there was ever a time in their lives the news got them riled up about something, only for them to realize they were being lied to or misled later on
ask them what they would do if certain commodities they take for granted were no longer on the shelves because someone across the world decided to blockade the shipments
Ain't no penetrating these propagandized galaxy brains. To them, the Russians have just always been the enemy, they're both unironic fans of Reagan, despite being Canucks. Any means are justified to them of course, they're well insulated from the chance of actually doing any fighting or anything so they've got no real skin in the game, it's just culture war shit as usual. I can explain that Russia has always been unjustifiably been viewed as the enemy empire, ever since the revolution and beyond, and that just confirms their preconceptions: Communism was bad so it was good to try and keep the Tsar in power.
Pardon my cope, these threads keep me sane among madpeople
my dad is a communist-sympathizer who studied in eastern europe during communism and just hates the west, so he's dangerously pro-russia in this thing lol
my mom on the other hand is just an old bored muslim woman that doesn't care much other than being contrarian, so she also supports putin too
that doesn’t care much other than being contrarian
Weird thought: makes me wonder if Christopher Hitchens would be pro-Putin if he were still alive.
Wasn't he a full on "They hate us for our freedom and way of life, we must bomb them for the sake of democracy" neocon?
Im pretty sure he would be advocating for nuking Putin first or something.
He was, so I think you're probably right. But there's an outside chance he would've flipped the script just to be disagreeable and get attention.
My parent thinks there is no war going on and all the footage is staged.
My mom still refers to the Russians as "the Soviets". Extra funny in this context because Ukraine was also a Soviet republic, and she seemed confused when I pointed that out.
