Thank you @SeventyTwoTrillion for all your effort. :sankara-salute:

Old Map for reference

If you have any useful resource links please tag me in a comment with the link:

Examples of racism/euro-centrism during the Russia-Ukraine conflict

Add to this if you can, thank you.

Links

Time/Map: https://time.is/Ukraine

https://www.google.com/maps/place/Ukraine/@49.1162725,31.7993839,7z/data=!4m5!3m4!1s0x40d1d9c154700e8f:0x1068488f64010!8m2!3d48.379433!4d31.1655799?hl=en

https://www.google.com/maps/d/viewer?mid=1B1PLMhbHmG1aJ2-QNxHY1TksI6HlNhqF&ll=48.60777942568106%2C36.4496511633501&z=7

Leftist discussion threads:

https://hexbear.net/post/177324

https://old.reddit.com/r/GenZedong/comments/t03foy/genzedong_russiaukraine_master_discussion_thread/ :kitty-cri-texas:

https://lemmygrad.ml/

Twitter military updaters:

https://nitter.42l.fr/RWApodcast

https://nitter.net/ASBMilitary :kitty-cri:

https://nitter.net/Militarylandnet

https://nitter.net/MihajlovicMike

https://nitter.net/KofmanMichael

https://nitter.net/TadeuszGiczan/status/1498673348183744518

https://www.youtube.com/c/DefensePoliticsAsia/videos

obvious disclaimers about taking all of them with tonnes of salt etc

Global South Perspective: https://nitter.net/kiranopal_/status/1498723206496145413

Better war/propaganda analysis:

https://www.understandingwar.org

https://www.moonofalabama.org/

News updates:

https://www.cgtn.com/special/UkraineCrisis.html

Live: https://www.cgtn.com/special/Live-update-Ukraine-Russia-border-crisis.html

YT/Video in Ukraine:

https://www.youtube.com/c/PatrickLancasterNewsToday/videos

https://www.youtube.com/c/RussellBentleyTe

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  • eel [he/him]
    ·
    3 years ago

    I'm just wondering where you get your news from. Has any reputable source debunked Russian war crimes?

      • eel [he/him]
        ·
        3 years ago

        I like the NYT, but generally if I see a new source, I'd run it by https://mediabiasfactcheck.com.

        • Alaskaball [comrade/them]MA
          ·
          3 years ago

          :agony-immense: FOR LEFT FUCKING BIAS IT PUT'S JoeBiden.com ALONGSIDE FUCKING MARXISTS.ORG

          • eel [he/him]
            ·
            3 years ago

            Left/right bias doesn't really mean anything. I just use it for the fact-checking. But if their fact-checking is inaccurate I'd be interested to hear.

              • eel [he/him]
                ·
                3 years ago

                Sorry, I don't get why the sarcasm. I'd trust the NYT over some random dude on hexbear who's source is "trust me bro".

                • Alaskaball [comrade/them]MA
                  ·
                  3 years ago

                  Hey did you hear the report the NYT released about those WMD's Sadam have? Scary if true

                  • eel [he/him]
                    ·
                    3 years ago

                    If the best you can come up with was an error nearly 20 years ago that they have admitted to and acknowledged... I'm just saying, I'm wondering where your news if coming from. Since I haven't seen any evidence that the war crimes were fabricated, but I'm open to hearing your perspective.

                    • Alaskaball [comrade/them]MA
                      ·
                      3 years ago

                      An error that distorted the world we live in today and destroyed the lives of millions. If you're open to hearing the perspective of the propaganda mouthpiece of the American terrorist state, then you're truly not open to hearing anything else.

                    • AutoVomBizMarkee [he/him]
                      ·
                      3 years ago

                      Ah yes, and before or after that one singular debacle, the NYT never ever carried water for US imperialism.

        • aaaaaaadjsf [he/him, comrade/them]
          ·
          3 years ago

          That is some off the charts pure liberalism in that website right there

          https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/left-vs-right-bias-how-we-rate-the-bias-of-media-sources/

          None of the stuff they listed as "left" is actually leftist. It's just basic social democratic policies many outright capitalist states have

          It's also heavily biased towards the USA in terms of localisation of what is left and right.

          It makes the classic mistake of liberal = left

    • GnastyGnuts [he/him]
      ·
      3 years ago

      Why would the burden of proof be to debunk the allegation, and not rest on the Ukrainian side to substantiate the allegations in the first place, particularly after pushing various stories that turned out to be falsehoods, like the Snake Island massacre, the Ghost of Kiev, the Mariupol theatre attack, etc.?

    • Alaskaball [comrade/them]MA
      ·
      3 years ago

      So, which one of your accounts got banned that had you dig this one out of the bin?

      • eel [he/him]
        ·
        3 years ago

        I honestly haven't really paid attention to hexbear since the early days. Are you going to ban me for asking for a source?

        • Alaskaball [comrade/them]MA
          ·
          3 years ago

          No, I'm gonna mark you publicly for being a fuckin lib and sit back and enjoy watching you get bullied

          • eel [he/him]
            ·
            3 years ago

            Fair enough. I'd still like to see a source, though

            • Alaskaball [comrade/them]MA
              ·
              3 years ago

              Fine, you want a source, here you go https://www.latlmes.com/world/what-we-know-about-russian-war-crimes-1

                • GnastyGnuts [he/him]
                  ·
                  3 years ago

                  I'm personally not familiar with LA Times as an outlet, but why specifically do you find NYT to be trustworthy (or at least trustworthy enough), but scoff at the use of LA Times?

                  • eel [he/him]
                    ·
                    3 years ago

                    Click the link, it's a rick-roll. I would generally trust the real LA Times.

    • BynarsAreOk [none/use name]
      ·
      3 years ago

      This particular twitter thread on burcha.

      The war news most people here get from telegram sources, ASB Military on twitter before they deleted their account, DPA who is just some guy also reading from telegram sources. Patrick Lancaster is posting almost daily videos of civilian deaths. Brian/The New Atlas is posting frequent updates too, though I like his China content more.

      The Ukrainian sources including official accounts on telegram are straight up useless propaganda. Here is a comparison video between Russian and Ukrainian telegram sources

      And of course @SeventyTwoTrillion is posting a lot of stuff here too.

      • eel [he/him]
        ·
        3 years ago

        The twitter thread was interesting. I'm not entirely sure what it's supposed to prove- what stood out to me was the video posted- despite that it's unclear what was said or if someone actually was shot, somebody did ask if they could shoot somebody, and maybe already had, if they thought that was okay to ask. I also have no doubt that some people were killed by Ukrainian shelling. But with the sheer amount of people killed and eyewitness accounts it does fail to convince me that there was not a massacre by Russian forces. He also accuses the NYT of moving a body, and by extension deliberately spreading fake news. The body looks to be in the same place to me, and the NYT deliberately spreading fake news would be as far as I know unprecedented. I wouldn't really trust what I hear from Russian- or Ukrainian, for that matter- news on Telegram, though. That seems to be mainly a platform to spread propaganda to try to get people who read it on your side.

        • BynarsAreOk [none/use name]
          ·
          3 years ago

          Ok so

          -The satellite images are already proven to be highly questionable and inconclusive, even the NYT admits the satellite alone can't prove how those people were killed.

          -We know some of the civilians have white armbands which the Russians use to mark friendly collaborators. Why would they massacre them?

          -I am hoping you are already aware the curious case of the mayor that didn't mention a massacre when he celebrated Russians leaving.

          -As the twitter thread alone gives a dozen different points against the narrative:

          Video of Ukraine shelling on Russia troops captured by drone.

          Video of Ukraine troops asking if they can shoot civilians.

          Video of civilian with tied hands and white armbands(Russian supporters)

          What is more likely?

          That Russia somehow committed a large irrational mass murder of civilians many of which were sympathizers despite very obvious military doctrine against this throughout the whole war?

          That Burcha was under constant shelling for most of the month, the bodies are most likely from different events at different days and as Russia decides to retreat the Ukrainian army decides to try yet again to frame another mass murder scene while giving no explanation or signs of regret for their own nazis conducts including doing these same sort of executions.

          We have a literal dozens of videos of people being lynched in public, we know Azov used human shields, they are torturing Russian POWs etc

          NYT deliberately spreading fake news would be as far as I know unprecedented.

          :shrug-outta-hecks:

          You want to live in a world where some guy in front of a TV or some editor for a fancy three letter newspaper earning 6 figures is a trustworthy figure but thousands of people crowdsourcing real videos during a war is "fake news".

          I can't imagine being you in 2002-2003 honestly but I guess everyone has to go through this stage I guess.

        • eddies [he/him]
          ·
          3 years ago

          Exactly how many dead constitutes a massacre in your opinion?

          • eel [he/him]
            ·
            3 years ago

            https://twitter.com/JamesAALongman/status/1511425069372817410 Maybe something like this?

            • eddies [he/him]
              ·
              3 years ago

              You know people can die in warzones without malicious intent?

              • eel [he/him]
                ·
                3 years ago

                Yes, however this is not what happened, did you read the thread? There's no point in denying Russian atrocities, just because the USA denounces them.

                • eddies [he/him]
                  ·
                  3 years ago

                  Im not saying average russian soldier is a saint but Bucha discourse is very clearly a propaganda operation on scale alone. We will see if there is any viable investigation.

        • ThomasMuentzner [he/him, comrade/them]
          ·
          3 years ago

          https://www.npu.gov.ua/news/stoprussia/speczpriznachenczi-naczpolicziji-rozpochali-zachistku-mista-bucha/

          https://www.ukrinform.net/rubric-ato/3445989-bucha-liberated-from-russian-invaders-mayor.html

          https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z7yIyNBMpQY

      • eel [he/him]
        ·
        3 years ago

        Liberalism is when you denounce war crimes, and the more war crimes you denounce, the liberaler you are.

        • ThomasMuentzner [he/him, comrade/them]
          ·
          3 years ago

          Liberalism is when you denounce war crimes, and the more war crimes you denounce, the liberaler you are.

          at this moment you feel civilised and of supiror interlect , a wolrd waiting for your lectures ..

          a true lib on Hexbear ... what a sight to behold...

        • ThomasMuentzner [he/him, comrade/them]
          ·
          3 years ago

          In many western countries, especially the US, propaganda is so strong that it’s no longer perceived as propaganda anymore, but just becomes “facts”. This means that people are so confident in US State Department narrative they cannot even conceive of anything outside of it, the idea that people can think something else is not only something they haven’t considered, but they have a mental block preventing them from even considering it.

          This is where the Russiagate and “wumao” stuff originates. They are so convinced of the US State Department narrative that they think anyone who disagrees can’t actually disagree, because it’s just “facts” that “everyone knows is true”. So if you do disagree, then you must be lying about your beliefs, you must be a paid actor of some kind.

          This also gets into why they’re so ready to support US interventions and wars. They genuinely believe the US State Department narrative is universal, that it’s something everyone agrees with. So they think that people in foreign countries all agree with the US narrative too. If you have video of them saying they don’t? Well, “there must be a hidden sniper forcing them to say that!”

          So, in their minds, all Chinese people agree with the US State Department narrative. They all hate the Chinese government and want to see it overthrown. They’re all secretly begging for their white saviors to come save them, but you just don’t see that happening because they are forced to pretend they don’t.

          So these people feel like they’re being “heroes” by constantly spamming stuff in support of what they view as prisoners in a nation-sized prison begging to be released. They think that they are “good people” by constantly bringing it up, that it makes them virtuous and that it’s a form of activism to constantly mention it.

          You have to remember that liberals are, well, liberal, they’re very individualistic. They’re convinced change is not brought about by collective action but through virtuous and heroic individuals. They thus have a tendency to strongly overestimate what their own actions are doing, and to actually view what they’re doing as real activism.

          In their mind, by “speaking up for the Chinese”, they think they’re actually doing something good and virtuous that is making a difference. They like to imagine that maybe a Chinese person with a VPN sees all the heroic Americans saying “west Taiwan” and reddit and gets a smile on their face knowing the good redditors are fighting for his freedom.

          That’s actually how they think. Legitimately.

          • TechnologyMoth [comrade/them,any]
            ·
            3 years ago

            What are you quoting from?

            This part is fierce "They thus have a tendency to strongly overestimate what their own actions are doing, and to actually view what they’re doing as real activism."